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Are the Nordic countries the most rational?

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    Posted: 13 Nov 2012 at 07:27

In several  surveys the Scandinavian countries have been designated as the best countries to live in. One can also notice that these countries seem to the most secular and rational countries in the world, i e they are governed on the basis of (at least fairly) rational thinking opposed to  many other countries where irrational ideology and religious superstition is a more prominent part of political and also everyday life.

Ofcourse there is some flaws in rationality even here, for example we have the current Swedish peddler governments  irrational belief in the market, but such beliefs are still minor compared with those in places like the US.

For many Swedes it is hard to grasp how it must be to live in countries like Iran or Saudi Arabia who is governed not by rational thinking but by irrational religious superstition or in hard dictarships as North Korea, or even in catholic countries where irrational beliefs thwarts the right of women to decide over their own bodies.



Edited by Carcharodon - 13 Nov 2012 at 10:45
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fantasus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Nov 2012 at 11:01

Or there is a tendency in part of the popultaion to exaggerate similarities, at least "internally".

Probably people here does not agree so much as many of them think, and there are even some antagonisms and hard feelings.

 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Zagros Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Nov 2012 at 15:46
Rational by what measure?  It is perceptual.  If you were a hardcore al qaeda sucide bomber Swedish life would be very irrational.
"There was glory in pissing, Corabb decided as he watched the stream curve out and make that familiar but unique sound as it hit the ground." So true.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Paradigm of Humanity Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Nov 2012 at 17:00
Nobody wonders how you manage your society so efficiently just because you're rich in GDP per capita. At best we wonder Scandinavian cousine, languages, local customs- not another duplicate of global popular culture...

In short, you're not special, sorry Smile

Edited by Paradigm of Humanity - 13 Nov 2012 at 17:02
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Parnell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Nov 2012 at 19:03
Scandanavians are special. They've created wealthy economies along with low inequality, fantastic social services and a robust safety net. There is virtually no extreme poverty. Work is a part of life, it is not the only life you will live. IN my mind, Sweden has created the perfect society, and it should be the aim of every civilised nation to mimic their social model where possible. 
http://xkcd.com/15/



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Al Jassas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Nov 2012 at 19:28
Its all about happiness. People do what makes them happy and by comparing suicide rates between "irrational" countries and "rational" Nordic countries we can easily deduce who is happy and who is not.
 
Yet again ignorance is bliss and who hates bliss?
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fantasus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Nov 2012 at 20:41
Not even in Scandinavia, at least as I know it everyone is that much like the other, and , believe it or not, there are differences in mentality and  opinions between individuals as well as different parts. I have this idea there often is a broader "spectre" or variation in a society, but the very vocal or influential and prestigeous groups are narrower. My own impression is that some less "mainstream", some would call it exttreme, positions have become more widespread for the last about two decades.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Styrbiorn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Nov 2012 at 20:53
Originally posted by Al Jassas Al Jassas wrote:

Its all about happiness. People do what makes them happy and by comparing suicide rates between "irrational" countries and "rational" Nordic countries we can easily deduce who is happy and who is not.
 

Please go ahead, and include analyses on how the statistics were collected in the first place and the reason behind the suicides. Sweden is around place 30-40 in the suicide stats, and with its extreme record-keeping that's pretty good. The suicide myth (together with porn and other things) were born as a part of an American political campaign as a counter to certain politicians using Sweden as a good example. Anyway, personally I find migration statistics much more telling (of course, they need to be compared with the possibility and ease of movement as well) on how satisfied a population is.



As for rationality, I find that hard to quantisize. It's certainly a more honest and less corrupt society than just about any I have encountered, which I believe is a larger contributor to the success than "rationality". There is obviously plenty of irrationality around, Carch himself being a proof of that. 


Edited by Styrbiorn - 13 Nov 2012 at 20:57
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Paradigm of Humanity Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Nov 2012 at 22:01
Originally posted by Parnell Parnell wrote:

Scandanavians are special. They've created wealthy economies along with low inequality, fantastic social services and a robust safety net. There is virtually no extreme poverty. Work is a part of life, it is not the only life you will live. IN my mind, Sweden has created the perfect society, and it should be the aim of every civilised nation to mimic their social model where possible. 

What's wrong with your own country? You know what? This is not my first encounter with that kind of point of view. You are somewhat at war with some values of your society and you're not happy with the way things going on. And believing an uthopian heavenly society exists relieves you. While there is nothing defaultly wrong with conflicting some of that existing paradimgs, this is also causing a tendency to idolise that society. I asked what's wrong with your own country because Ireland and Scandinavians are not really much different when compared to rest of the world. Sure there is some major distinctions like Catholism vs. Prostestanism, heavy laissez faire vs. heavy socialist economy... But life styles and culture are quite similar in general sense.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pinguin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Nov 2012 at 03:08
If that is such a wonderful place, why, then, the suicide rates of Nordic countries are higher than other developed countries?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fantasus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Nov 2012 at 07:30
Originally posted by pinguin pinguin wrote:

If that is such a wonderful place, why, then, the suicide rates of Nordic countries are higher than other developed countries?
Who says so? How do we know statistics are correct for those countries claiming 0 - zero suicides?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Al Jassas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Nov 2012 at 08:44
Unfortunately I know a thing or two about suicide here in Saudi Arabia since some of my own relatives have gone down that path and from this painful experience I can tell you that not only we are the anomoly* but also that suicide rates are about 1/10th of that of Sweden (little more than 1/100k) and these are official numbers done after a sudden rise in rates in the last 15 years.
 
My point about suicide is that it is the ultimate irrational decision a person can make no matter what justification he\she makes up. Rational people don't committ suicide.
 
 
*I have direct blood relations with 5 different families and only one of them (my own clan that I belong to) has had a suicide (in fact 3 and within the space of 12 years) in the last 30 years. The rest have not recorded any suicide at all.
 
 
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Edited by Al Jassas - 14 Nov 2012 at 08:49
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Styrbiorn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Nov 2012 at 10:48
Originally posted by pinguin pinguin wrote:

If that is such a wonderful place, why, then, the suicide rates of Nordic countries are higher than other developed countries?
 

They are on par with most of the developed countries, not higher.  http://nitawriter.wordpress.com/2007/05/11/suicide-rates-of-the-world/

Originally posted by Al Jassas Al Jassas wrote:

Unfortunately I know a thing or two about suicide here in Saudi Arabia since some of my own relatives have gone down that path and from this painful experience I can tell you that not only we are the anomoly* but also that suicide rates are about 1/10th of that of Sweden (little more than 1/100k) and these are official numbers done after a sudden rise in rates in the last 15 years.
 
My point about suicide is that it is the ultimate irrational decision a person can make no matter what justification he\she makes up. Rational people don't committ suicide.
 
 
*I have direct blood relations with 5 different families and only one of them (my own clan that I belong to) has had a suicide (in fact 3 and within the space of 12 years) in the last 30 years. The rest have not recorded any suicide at all.
 
 
Al-Jassas
 
And just how reliable do you believe the statistics are in a country where suicide is extremely stigmatized and religiously forbidden? I read a report from India, claiming that there rates are 5 to 10 times higher than the official due to a reluctance to report suicides within the family. I would be surprised if the situation was not similar in Saudi Arabia.< id="_npwlo" ="applicationpwlo" height="0">
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Carcharodon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Nov 2012 at 11:22
Originally posted by Styrbiorn Styrbiorn wrote:

There is obviously plenty of irrationality around, Carch himself being a proof of that. 
 
Do not confuse mental clearnes with irrationality.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Parnell Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Nov 2012 at 13:05
Originally posted by Paradigm of Humanity Paradigm of Humanity wrote:

Originally posted by Parnell Parnell wrote:

Scandanavians are special. They've created wealthy economies along with low inequality, fantastic social services and a robust safety net. There is virtually no extreme poverty. Work is a part of life, it is not the only life you will live. IN my mind, Sweden has created the perfect society, and it should be the aim of every civilised nation to mimic their social model where possible. 

What's wrong with your own country? You know what? This is not my first encounter with that kind of point of view. You are somewhat at war with some values of your society and you're not happy with the way things going on. And believing an uthopian heavenly society exists relieves you. While there is nothing defaultly wrong with conflicting some of that existing paradimgs, this is also causing a tendency to idolise that society. I asked what's wrong with your own country because Ireland and Scandinavians are not really much different when compared to rest of the world. Sure there is some major distinctions like Catholism vs. Prostestanism, heavy laissez faire vs. heavy socialist economy... But life styles and culture are quite similar in general sense.


Ireland assembled a welfare system from scratch without any coherent ideology. The political system is pragmatic, which in a sense isn't a bad thing (There is no major left/right faultline in Irish politics) but the net result is lack of mission. Our social services are very weak compared to European nations. We wasted the fiscal benefits of our boom on lowering taxes and building bridges and wage increases for public sector workers. The social infrastructure isn't in place. If we had have given that money and power away to a few Nordic bureaucrats we could have created something lasting and socially useful, but we completely blew it. Fat chance of us creating a Nordic social system now given our debt and our position in the global economic crisis, but one must always live in hope.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Carcharodon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 07:18
Another example of irrational thinking:
 
Quote A Pakistani court has sentenced a man to death for blasphemy.

Police identified the man as Hazrat Ali Shah, who was reported as being in his mid-20s.
He was convicted on November 15 after a trial in the remote northwestern district of Chitral.
Amir Khan, a local police official, says Shah was arrested in March 2011 for profanity against the Prophet Mohammad.
 
 
When will countries like Pakistan start to sentence people according to laws based on rational principles instead of blind superstition? Maybe countries like that should be excluded from the UN and boycotted until they learn to abide to human rights and principles of freedom of speech and religious freedom (also the freedom FROM religion).

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fantasus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Nov 2012 at 14:51
Originally posted by Carcharodon Carcharodon wrote:

Another example of irrational thinking:
 
Quote A Pakistani court has sentenced a man to death for blasphemy.

Police identified the man as Hazrat Ali Shah, who was reported as being in his mid-20s.
He was convicted on November 15 after a trial in the remote northwestern district of Chitral.
Amir Khan, a local police official, says Shah was arrested in March 2011 for profanity against the Prophet Mohammad.
 
 
When will countries like Pakistan start to sentence people according to laws based on rational principles instead of blind superstition? Maybe countries like that should be excluded from the UN and boycotted until they learn to abide to human rights and principles of freedom of speech and religious freedom (also the freedom FROM religion).

To a very large extend simply a tool for power, were concerns for "allah and his prophet" is not necessarily the primary thing. At least we may have this suspicion the real motivation is different to some degree.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Woofer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Sep 2013 at 11:06
Originally posted by Al Jassas Al Jassas wrote:

Its all about happiness. People do what makes them happy and by comparing suicide rates between "irrational" countries and "rational" Nordic countries we can easily deduce who is happy and who is not.
 
Yet again ignorance is bliss and who hates bliss?
 
Al-Jassas


I think you have failed to take in the most important issue which is depression caused by lack of sunlight. All people who live in polar and sub polar regions have high rates of suicide for this reason
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Woofer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Sep 2013 at 11:07
The Nordic countries , especially Sweden, can by suffocating with their need for conformity. Individuality is fromned upon as is cultural innovation. Abba was actually ostracised in Sweden and had to Move to the UK.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Goral Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Sep 2013 at 05:38

If Scandinavian countries are paradise on the earth, why by Jove there is so many Scandinavian immigrants in Australia and virtually  no Australian immigrants in Scandinavia ?(with same notable exception; Mary of Denmark)Smile



Edited by Goral - 18 Sep 2013 at 05:40
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fantasus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Sep 2013 at 17:04
The nordic countries have their own societal questions and problems. Wether anybody wants to live there is up to them. But I am unaware their peoples migrate more than so many other in these years (to ausralia or anywhere else), and most part of them are not "polar" or "subpolar" in any way. From a point of view of natural geography it may be seen as the largest and most diverse European region west of Russia.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Goral Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Sep 2013 at 22:36

The 2006 Australian census showed 30,375 who claimed Swedish ancestry.

At the 2006 Census 8,963 Australian residents declared they were born in Denmark. In addition 50,413 Australian residents claimed Danish ancestry

 

The latest Census in 2011 recorded 3710 Norway-born people in Australia, an increase of 2.2 per cent from the 2006 Census. 



Edited by Goral - 18 Sep 2013 at 22:44
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fantasus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Sep 2013 at 08:50
Originally posted by Goral Goral wrote:

The 2006 Australian census showed 30,375 who claimed Swedish ancestry.

At the 2006 Census 8,963 Australian residents declared they were born in Denmark. In addition 50,413 Australian residents claimed Danish ancestry

 

The latest Census in 2011 recorded 3710 Norway-born people in Australia, an increase of 2.2 per cent from the 2006 Census. 

the situation was different many decades ago, when many of those immigrants may have arrived.
Still there is both migration from and to Scandinavian countries - the same as for most other European countries. So I think those numbers are not at all extremely or even remarkably high. But yes: Some don´t like it here as much as oithers.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Goral Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Sep 2013 at 01:44
Note number of Scandinavian-Australian born in Scandinavian countries. Also please note increase of Norwegian born  Australian between 2006 and 2011 censuses, despite enormous North Sea Oil revenue and very high standard of life. 
 There would be more Nordic migrants in Australia if Australians will  open theirs door wider.

 At present it is extremely difficult (AFAIK) for Scandinavian  to obtain emigration visa to Australia



Edited by Goral - 20 Sep 2013 at 03:52
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fantasus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Sep 2013 at 14:53
Originally posted by Goral Goral wrote:

Note number of Scandinavian-Australian born in Scandinavian countries. Also please note increase of Norwegian born  Australian between 2006 and 2011 censuses, despite enormous North Sea Oil revenue and very high standard of life. 
 There would be more Nordic migrants in Australia if Australians will  open theirs door wider.

 At present it is extremely difficult (AFAIK) for Scandinavian  to obtain emigration visa to Australia

I find it har to make any conclussions based upon such immigration, since there is so many possible ways to look at it. One possible view of course are Scandinavians are in fact not at all happy wioth their countries, but would if possible leave en masse. Another way to see it: Those who did not like their own copuntries has largely left, so the "happy ones" remains. Perhaps what some likes the most are what others hate about their countries? Personally KI have some reservations towards what probably others sees as particularly "good". I am not even so sure that there is not a reverse side to the "rational" mentallity here, though I don´t see muslim extremism as in any way a possitive alternative at all.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Styrbiorn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Sep 2013 at 13:26
Originally posted by Goral Goral wrote:

If Scandinavian countries are paradise on the earth, why by Jove there is so many Scandinavian immigrants in Australia and virtually  no Australian immigrants in Scandinavia ?(with same notable exception; Mary of Denmark)Smile


The are 5 million immigrants in Scandinavia, and compared to the few thousand moving to get some sun in Australia that is quite telling if you want to determine this from immigration. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Goral Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Sep 2013 at 01:58
Where these emigrants to Scandinavia come from? Almost exclusively from poor Asian, African and former Soviet Block countries.
For them Scandinavia is a paradise on the earth. But for the rest? I have my doubts,gentlemen.
High standard of life and social benefits are not necessary the only prescription for happiness.
Below is the "Happy countries 2012" list. Scandinavians are pretty low on this list.There is no absolute measurement of "Happiness"

Here is a Full List of the World's Happiest Countries For 2012. This result differ radically from the 2013 results.


The so-called Happy Planet Index released its 2012 results. The organization released its 2012 list of happiest countries in the world. The happiest country in the world for 2012? Costa Rica (Pura Vida!) Latin America features prominently in the top 10 with eight of the 10 happiest countries located in Central and South America.

How do they rate the world's happiest countries? The HCI describes its methods here.

Here is the complete list of happiest countries for 2012

1    Costa Rica
2    Vietnam
3    Colombia
4    Belize
5    El Salvador
6    Jamaica
7    Panama
8    Nicaragua
9    Venezuela
10    Guatemala
11    Bangladesh
12    Cuba
13    Honduras
14    Indonesia
15    Israel
16    Pakistan
17    Argentina
18    Albania
19    Chile
20    Thailand
21    Brazil
22    Mexico
23    Ecuador
24    Peru
25    Philippines
26    Algeria
27    Jordan
28    New Zealand
29    Norway
30    Palestine
31    Guyana
32    India
33    Dominican Republic
34    Switzerland
35    Sri Lanka
36    Iraq
37    Laos
38    Kyrgyzstan
39    Tunisia
40    Moldova
41    United Kingdom
42    Morocco
43    Tajikistan
44    Turkey
45    Japan
46    Germany
47    Syria
48    Austria
49    Madagascar
50    France
51    Italy
52    Sweden
53    Armenia
54    Uzbekistan
55    Georgia
56    Saudi Arabia
57    Paraguay
58    Nepal
59    Cyprus
60    China
61    Myanmar
62    Spain
63    Korea
64    Bolivia
65    Canada
66    Malta
67    Netherlands
68    Yemen
69    Lebanon
70    Finland
71    Poland
72    Malawi
73    Ireland
74    Bosnia and Herzegovina
75    Romania
76    Australia
77    Iran
78    Haiti
79    Serbia
80    Azerbaijan
81    Libya
82    Croatia
83    Greece
84    Malaysia
85    Cambodia
86    Ghana
87    Slovenia
88    Iceland
89    Slovakia
90    Singapore
91    Egypt
92    Czech Republic
93    Uruguay
94    Ethiopia
95    Turkmenistan
96    Namibia
97    Portugal
98    Kenya
99    Zambia
100    Ukraine
101    Sudan
102    Hong Kong
103    Belarus
104    Hungary
105    United States of America
106    Djibouti
107    Belgium
108    Rwanda
109    Afghanistan
110    Denmark
111    Mauritius
112    Comoros
113    Cote d'Ivoire
114    Mozambique
115    Zimbabwe
116    Liberia
117    Estonia
118    Latvia
119    Kazakhstan
120    Lithuania
121    Congo
122    Russia
123    Bulgaria
124    Cameroon
125    Nigeria
126    Senegal
127    Angola
128    Mauritania
129    Burkina Faso
130    United Arab Emirates
131    Uganda
132    Benin
133    Tanzania
134    Congo, Dem. Rep. of the
135    Burundi
136    Trinidad and Tobago
137    Guinea
138    Luxembourg
139    Sierra Leone
140    Macedonia
141    Togo
142    South Africa
143    Kuwait
144    Niger
145    Mongolia
146    Bahrain
147    Mali
148    Central African Republic
149    Qatar
150    Chad
151    Botswana



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Styrbiorn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Sep 2013 at 22:31
Originally posted by Goral Goral wrote:

Where these emigrants to Scandinavia come from? Almost exclusively from poor Asian, African and former Soviet Block countries.
For them Scandinavia is a paradise on the earth. But for the rest? I have my doubts,gentlemen.
High standard of life and social benefits are not necessary the only prescription for happiness.
Below is the "Happy countries 2012" list. Scandinavians are pretty low on this list.There is no absolute measurement of "Happiness"

Here is a Full List of the World's Happiest Countries For


Most immigrants are from Finland, the other Nordic countries, and Europe. Rest comes from "poor" countries.

That's some silly home-brewn index you showed: basicly it divides how happy people reported that feel they are with how poor they are: ie the poorer the better index value (some hippie notion of "ecological footprint", as if a polluter couldn't be happy).... Very strange. 

Look instead on the list on the same page showing people how satisfied people are with their life, which really is what matters:

Denmark 36.6 7.8 78.8 8.3 Canada 43.6 7.7 81.0 6.4 Norway 51.4 7.6 81.1 4.8 Venezuela 56.9 7.5 74.4 3.0 Switzerland 50.3 7.5 82.3 5.0 Sweden 46.2 7.5 81.4 5.7 Netherlands 43.1 7.5 80.7 6.3 Israel 55.2 7.4 81.6 4.0 Finland 42.7 7.4 80.0 6.2 Australia 42.0 7.4 81.9 6.7 - See more at: http://www.happyplanetindex.org/data/#sthash.IMTtwcjX.dpuf


Socialist or semi-socialist countries. And, indeed, sunnny Australia!

Sorry about the editing I got from copy-paste, can't be bothered to fix it.


Edited by Styrbiorn - 23 Sep 2013 at 22:33
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Goral Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Sep 2013 at 04:21
[QUOTE=Styrbiorn]
Most immigrants are from Finland, the other Nordic countries, and Europe. Rest comes from "poor" countries.

I wish that you will provide same facts , not your opinion only.

In 2010 14.3% of Sweden inhabitants were foreign-born. 859,000 of them were from outside of European Union.(477,000 were from European Union countries including former Soviet block states.

 

25 largest immigrant populations by country of origin 2011[11][12]

Country

Men

Women

Population

Finland Finland

67,184

99,539

166,723

Iraq Iraq

67,851

57,648

125,499

Bosnia and Herzegovina Bosnia and Herzegovina

43,751

49,539

92,290

Socialist Federal Republic of Yugoslavia Former Yugoslavia

35,434

34,616

70,050

Iran Islamic Republic of Iran

33,564

30,264

63,828

Poland Poland

21,449

28,069

49,518

Germany Germany

22,722

25,720

48,442

Denmark Denmark

24,007

20,944

44,951

Turkey Turkey

24,007

19,727

43,909

Norway Norway

18,904

24,154

43,058

Somalia Somalia

20,265

19,900

40,165

Thailand Thailand

7,352

26,261

33,613

Chile Chile

14,309

14,076

28,385

China China (excluding Hong Kong)

10,155

15,502

25,657

Lebanon Lebanon

13,543

10,851

24,394

Syria Syrian Arab Republic

11,507

10,850

22,357

United Kingdom United Kingdom

14,492

7,391

21,883

Romania Romania

10,104

10,912

21,016

India India

9,476

9,146

18,622

United States United States of America

9,340

8,415

17,755

Afghanistan Afghanistan

10,589

6,900

17,489

Russia Russian Federation

5,411

11,001

16,412

Hungary Hungary

7,705

7,736

15,441

Vietnam Vietnam

6,973

8,202

15,175

Ethiopia Ethiopia

7,380

6,934

14,314

Greece Greece

7,181

4,881

12,062

Immigrants from other countries

183,166

175,837

359,003

Total immigrant population

694,815

732,481

1,427,296



[QUOTE=Styrbiorn]
That's some silly home-brewn index you showed: basicly it divides how happy people reported that feel they are with how poor they are: ie the poorer the better index value (some hippie notion of "ecological footprint", as if a polluter couldn't be happy).... Very strange. 

"Home brewn index"?

 There is a big different between Happy Countries and Happy people. I'm at present doping long trip through south Pacific countries. 
I have seen there a lot of very happy people however they not are not as rich as Scandinavians are, but they are probably much happier. I may or may not agree with the finding  of Happy Planet Index but its shown that the results depends of criteria used for the ranking. But per capita income is certainly not the right approach. 



Edited by Goral - 30 Sep 2013 at 04:36
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fantasus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Sep 2013 at 09:29
I have to ask myself what this thread is about? What consequences can be made from different views of who is mostg "happy" and does this idea of collective "happiness" makes sense at all?
How "rational" different people are is a different question but still I have some doubts about ranking it, particularly on a collective basis. Individually we can have different attitudes and no doubt there are statistical differences between different populations if we look at who have different attitudes, beliefs, moods etcetera. Still I think any serious answer must be on an individual level:"Are You happy?" "Are You satisfied?", "What do You believe in?" "Are You so and so "rational"?" "Would emigration solve anything for You?" Then statistics may show wether, say, how people on average perform in different parts of the planet. And I think it is not appropriate to say anything like "there is a concensus among Scandinavians about what is "rational", how society should be in details or if belief in god,gods or anything "spiritual" makes any sense to them, since we will found divergent opinions here as anywhere else (where people are free to express their views).
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