| FORUM | ARCHIVE |                    | TOTAL QUIZ RESULT |


  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Can Greece learn to balance its books?
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login


Welcome stranger, click here to read about some of the great benefits of registering for a free account with us and joining us in our global online community.


Can Greece learn to balance its books?

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 789
Author
Flipper View Drop Down
Caliph
Caliph
Avatar

Joined: 23 Apr 2006
Location: Anatolia&Balkan
Status: Offline
Points: 2798
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flipper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2010 at 06:43
Originally posted by gcle2003 gcle2003 wrote:

But will it solve the issue of Turkish vs Greek coffee?


Lol LOL
That is not an issue. The coffee was brewed like that before Turks, Greeks and Arabs were drinking it. The way of cooking is the same, the taste is different. Greek coffee is usually very light, Turkish is a bit in the middle and the more you reach middle east it gets a much stronger and heavy.

Btw, while I was in Turkey last summer I heard that the way of cooking the coffee like that (in this part of the world) comes from Ethiopia.
FΑΝΑΚΤΟΥ ΜΙΔΑ ΓΟΝΟΣ
Back to Top
Sponsored Links


Back to Top
Al Jassas View Drop Down
King
King


Joined: 08 Aug 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 5000
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Al Jassas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2010 at 07:42
Originally posted by Flipper Flipper wrote:

Originally posted by gcle2003 gcle2003 wrote:

But will it solve the issue of Turkish vs Greek coffee?


Lol LOL
That is not an issue. The coffee was brewed like that before Turks, Greeks and Arabs were drinking it. The way of cooking is the same, the taste is different. Greek coffee is usually very light, Turkish is a bit in the middle and the more you reach middle east it gets a much stronger and heavy.

Btw, while I was in Turkey last summer I heard that the way of cooking the coffee like that (in this part of the world) comes from Ethiopia.
 
Ethiopeans eat the beans (or they used to), it was Arabs that actually brewed it as a drink and the plant is indiginous to both Arabia and Ethiopia.
 
A drink for the religious elites, it reached the Turks after the Ottoman conquest of the middle east and the janisseries of all Turks were responsible for its popularity. The Turks found two types of coffee, the Bedouin black and the flavoured light, they preferred the strong Bedouin type which became the Turkish coffee.
 
Al-Jassas
Back to Top
Antioxos View Drop Down
Consul
Consul


Joined: 26 Apr 2006
Status: Offline
Points: 372
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Antioxos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2010 at 07:43
Originally posted by Seko Seko wrote:

Despite what effect our friend Graham has on this conversation, this is what the CIA factbook says on GDP by sector:

Agriculture 3.4%
Industry 20.8%
Services 75.8%





well i did a small search and i found the 2008 Annual Report of the Bank of Greece ,
page 55
(2009 is not translated yet in English )

http://www.bankofgreece.gr/Pages/en/Publications/GovReport.aspx?Filter_By=8





2009
1. Private consumption  130.612,00 70,85%
2. Public consumption 32.805,99 17,80%
3. Gross fixed capital formation 33.630,89 18,24%
5. Change in inventories and statistical discrepancy 2.398,00 1,30%
6. Exports of goods and services 35.500,47 19,26%
8. Imports of goods and services -50.601,06 -27,45%
GDP at market prices 184.346,29 100,00%
























more than 70 % of Greek GDP based on consumption  this make GDP easily negative  when the salaries are cut (reduced internal demand).




Edited by Antioxos - 16 May 2010 at 07:52
Back to Top
Antioxos View Drop Down
Consul
Consul


Joined: 26 Apr 2006
Status: Offline
Points: 372
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Antioxos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2010 at 07:47
Originally posted by Flipper Flipper wrote:

Originally posted by gcle2003 gcle2003 wrote:

But will it solve the issue of Turkish vs Greek coffee?


Lol LOL
That is not an issue. The coffee was brewed like that before Turks, Greeks and Arabs were drinking it. The way of cooking is the same, the taste is different. Greek coffee is usually very light, Turkish is a bit in the middle and the more you reach middle east it gets a much stronger and heavy.

Btw, while I was in Turkey last summer I heard that the way of cooking the coffee like that (in this part of the world) comes from Ethiopia.


in cyprus they call it Cypriot coffee (i order it as a greek coffee Embarrassed)
Back to Top
Antioxos View Drop Down
Consul
Consul


Joined: 26 Apr 2006
Status: Offline
Points: 372
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Antioxos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2010 at 20:02
Originally posted by Antioxos Antioxos wrote:

Originally posted by Seko Seko wrote:

Despite what effect our friend Graham has on this conversation, this is what the CIA factbook says on GDP by sector:

Agriculture 3.4%
Industry 20.8%
Services 75.8%





well i did a small search and i found the 2008 Annual Report of the Bank of Greece ,
page 55
(2009 is not translated yet in English )

http://www.bankofgreece.gr/Pages/en/Publications/GovReport.aspx?Filter_By=8





2009
1. Private consumption  130.612,00 70,85%
2. Public consumption 32.805,99 17,80%
3. Gross fixed capital formation 33.630,89 18,24%
5. Change in inventories and statistical discrepancy 2.398,00 1,30%
6. Exports of goods and services 35.500,47 19,26%
8. Imports of goods and services -50.601,06 -27,45%
GDP at market prices 184.346,29 100,00%
























more than 70 % of Greek GDP based on consumption  this make GDP easily negative  when the salaries are cut (reduced internal demand).




some more data about the private consumption in other countries



Private

Consum

(% GDP)


Greece 71,00%
USA  69,30%
Portugal
64,40%
Italy 58,70%
Germany
57,10%
France 55,70%
Spain 55,00%
Belgium
50,90%
Denmark 48,40%
Sweden
44,90%



http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_Obux2PIbBPg/S55BF9PGR9I/AAAAAAAAB2E/i469AA1mi-Y/s1600-h/s12_page1_image1.jpg






Back to Top
Antioxos View Drop Down
Consul
Consul


Joined: 26 Apr 2006
Status: Offline
Points: 372
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Antioxos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2010 at 20:29
A few days after agreeing to create a European mechanism for assistance to Greece and while spread had again risen to record heights, a leading columnist of the "Financial Times" predicted that Greece than the money they get will not be able to avoid bankruptcy.
 It was not the only nor the first.  This article, however, one of the two most important financial newspaper in the world, had a distinctive feature: a series based on convenience and mildly arbitrary calculations!

It noted, for example, that Greece will need to borrow about 250 billion over the next five years, without specifying that the bulk of this amount did not cover additional new debt refinancing, but the old one.  Still estimated that nominal GDP will fall about 4% - providing highly unlikely as inflation is running at a rate above 4%.  As for the slowdown, it believed it would continue after 2011 - while all international organizations provide to the contrary, without explaining how and why.

Naturally, the publication has caused reactions. In a period of extreme sensitivity of the markets, powered with such information fosters panic and undermine efforts to restore confidence in Greece. .  Two leading Greek economists, professors and advisors at the University of Eurobank, Chardouve lis and D. MalliaropoulosMalliaropoulos, sent responsive letters noting the inaccuracies and giving a more realistic version of events.  The letters never published.

  The newspaper proved restricted in any other terms that undermine its critical capabilities of Greece and the euro area, essentially to address the debt problem.

Was there intent? Some are convinced of it, perceived political and speculative games behind this second phase of the global financial crisis now.  The truth however is that the critical period between December and April when you come down the stairs one by one international unreliability, the voices of advocacy was minimal.  Hand bombing was bad press and even in publications primarily inform investors.

Some believe that for this much responsibility belongs to the government.  The inability to pass the most basic aspects of the absence of a distinct societal strategy that was not even an international consultant, is another aspect of unprepared when she took to handle the crisis.

  For being unprepared, of course, there can be no doubt. Ακόμα και μετά τις εκλογές ο κ. Γ. Even after the elections, Papandreou believed and explicitly said in a statement that Greece will continue to increase its borrowings. Under the influence of the American Nobel laureate economist Joseph Stigklitz plan was to make the famous green investment to increase growth without the need for frugality. Even in December, just before the announcements of the Prime minister  PASOK considered subversive act of any reference to "turn" in economic policy.

But of course, Mr. Papandreou was not only unprepared. Ο  Mr. Al.Tsipras , For example, can now claim that we would avoid the IMF if we take timely action, but then we characterized the crisis as an "ogre" of fairy tales and harshly criticized any measure. . At the same time, many writers argue that debt levels are similar in other countries.

To be fair, the same thinking and shopping.  In an article in "New York bouquet Riviou" Paul Krugman pointed out that although they were well known figures on debt, investors continued to lend to Greece without any problem almost to the end of 2009.  The truth is that neither they had predicted the crisis.

But the question remains.We could avoid the IMF if the government had taken timely action? May, although it will never know.  Those who adopt this view, however, should explain a contradiction in leading their reasoning.  If the problem was only Greek, then the involvement of the IMF should have solved the problem.  But we saw that the crisis has spread to all the stock and had a wide mobilization and the promise of a bundle billion to support the euro in order to to calm temporally

If the crisis was so fast the world is not utopian to believe that could itself Greece to treat it? By this reasoning also believe the government that vindicate the policy of Mr. Papandreou sought to create a European mechanism assistance, which no doubt saved us from bankruptcy.

http://translate.google.gr/translate?js=y&prev=_t&hl=el&ie=UTF-8&layout=1&eotf=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.tovima.gr%2Fdefault.asp%3Fpid%3D2%26ct%3D32%26artId%3D331923%26dt%3D16%2F05%2F2010&sl=el&tl=en


automatic translation
  
Back to Top
Flipper View Drop Down
Caliph
Caliph
Avatar

Joined: 23 Apr 2006
Location: Anatolia&Balkan
Status: Offline
Points: 2798
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flipper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Jun 2010 at 20:10
This is something that has been discussed for many years in Greece, but of course is being easily labeled as a conspiracy theory. People believe in this more and more and don't be surprised if people decide to take the situation in their own hands in the close future. It has happened many times in the past in one of worlds cockroach nations.




FΑΝΑΚΤΟΥ ΜΙΔΑ ΓΟΝΟΣ
Back to Top
Leonidas View Drop Down
Tsar
Tsar
Avatar

Joined: 01 Oct 2005
Status: Offline
Points: 4853
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Leonidas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jul 2011 at 00:24
Bump for relevance! Well it's like over a year and the 'extend and pretend' phony solution has failed and the new solution is to do more of the same. After reading into the second crack at the austerity measures my attitude has changed. The Greeks have every right to protest to the new austerity measures. They won't fix anything and simply serve to help the lenders. Raising taxes on those that pay taxes while not addressing tax leakage is doomed to fail.

Edited by Leonidas - 03 Jul 2011 at 00:25
Back to Top
Al Jassas View Drop Down
King
King


Joined: 08 Aug 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 5000
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Al Jassas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Jul 2011 at 20:26

A deal has finally been struck two days ago to solve the debt crisis. The euros gave far more powers to the ECB and the stability funds than previously existed especially that they can now deal directly with banks in addition of course to +100 billion euros in cash. The most important part in my opinion is that the maturity of much of the debt will be postponed and bondholders will take a 21% loss on their debts which is another universe means that Greece actually is in a defacto default status. A good deal? Probably. But yet again the Greek economy needs to grow to compensate for the austerity measures taken by the government:

 
Al-Jassas
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 789
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 12.01
Copyright ©2001-2018 Web Wiz Ltd.

This page was generated in 0.109 seconds.