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Descendants of crusaders in modern Georgia

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gcle2003 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gcle2003 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Aug 2010 at 05:11
Other than Knights Templar could wear the red cross, as indeed Richard the Lion Heart did (in fact it was his dream of St George wearing a red cross that is said to have led to the adoption of the saint and the badge for England). This though the English up till more or less this time wore white crosses (on what ground I don't know).
 
 
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Omar al Hashim View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Omar al Hashim Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Aug 2010 at 10:11
Originally posted by fantasus fantasus wrote:

There is a lot of ways genes could have "flowed" from Europe to the Eastern Meditteraneans and Caucasus as well as the other way. Even over 2000 years ago before the socalled "Great Migrations" there were celtic invasions at least into Balkans and Anatolia(Galatians). Then there was the greeks and Macedonians, the Romans, perhaps some slavic peoples, slaves from the north, Mercenaries to Constantinople, tradesmen, Crusaders, Venetians and Genovans, Russians, european peoples in the service of the ottoman sultans. Then even from prehistoric times there were campaigns (the Illiad could perhaps refer to some past events). So it would be strange if there was not some degree of "mixing", perhaps to be traced even to Georgia or the Arabian peninsula.
Millions of Europeans have come as refugees, economic migrants, and slaves into the middle east just over the last 500 years. You don't have to go looking.
 
But there is no reason to think that "European" colouring and features is not native to middle eastern people - it is.
 
At a uni open day once, I saw two Arabs walk into the room. Then entered their Blond Anglo father and black Southern African mother. They weren't Arab at all, but I would've bet anything that they were.
 
Similarly, just a couple of days ago I was at a restaurant trying to guess where the waitress was from. I though Algeria, mum was going for lebanon, and my dad was aiming for Indonesian. When we asked her she said French! Her mum was franco-french, her dad was madagascan, and she grew up on Reunion.
 
Colouring, whether pale or dark is no reason to think that someone isn't from the middle east. If I sun a norweigian for six months I can pass him off as Lebanese.
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Reginmund View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Reginmund Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Aug 2010 at 00:57
We could try. Problem is the longer I spend in the sun the lighter my hair becomes.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Seko- Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Aug 2010 at 01:51
Same here Reg, when I get bronzed my skin gets to be African but my hair (what I have left of it) says Norwegian and my mannerisms and physical features say cool dude. Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Omar al Hashim Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Aug 2010 at 09:46
Originally posted by Reginmund Reginmund wrote:

We could try. Problem is the longer I spend in the sun the lighter my hair becomes.
Try some real sun Evil Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote caucasus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Oct 2010 at 11:52

Greetings everyoneSmile, I am Georgian.(sorry for my bad english)  our king david IV  had contacts with crusaders. 100  crusade fought with us against turk- seljuks in didgori battle. our queen tamar's son george  was crusade ,but when george was going to go to jerusalem by that time, mongols came to georgia and  george killed by mongols.  our medieval flag was st.george's flag. now about khevsurs. khevsurs, pshavs and tushs (they live in great caucasus) were one tribe and their name was pkhovels.  khevsurs were lived in shatili 

but now village is emptyUnhappy

khevsuretian warrior clothes

khevsuretian traditional clothes

this is song and clip about khevsuretian girl. song name  girl from shatili(shatilis asulo)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ArCGNGYtqws









 



                                                                               

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MorningMist Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Dec 2010 at 09:55
hello i am a georgian and i want to tell you that this persone J-sus  is not a georgian
he is an antigeorgian probably armenian or russian who is telling nothing but sh*t

georgians are not short for example i m 1.84 and my father is the same and my brother is even taller. we were 15 boys in my classe and only two were shorts and yet there are at least 1.70
my cousins all have blue eyes  and georgians dont have big noses 

as for khevsurs
the khevsurs are warrior people who live in the mountains of georgia and their traditional clothe are full with cross but everything is local. where were franks when the apostoles came to georgia and when georgia converted.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cywr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Jun 2012 at 03:03
Originally posted by Omar al Hashim Omar al Hashim wrote:

Originally posted by Sarmat Sarmat wrote:

also it's believed that they look more Western European (fair skin, blond and red hair, blue and green eyes) than the rest of Georgians.

Are you suggesting they look more 'Caucasian' than people from the Caucases?


Maybe they were purer, err, yeah that would explain it LOL

Wasn't there a connection between Genoa and Georgia, pre-dating the crusades. Genoa even copied Georgia's flag.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote toyomotor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Feb 2014 at 20:13
Originally posted by Parnell Parnell wrote:

Originally posted by Sarmat Sarmat wrote:

They, obviously, aren't crusaders. But there is nothing wrong if they had some crusaders' influence in the Middle Ages. The question is, was it really crusaders' influence or not? That's already interesting enough IMHO.

 

Its an interesting idea, but is there any written evidence of Frankish families making it to Georgia in the middle ages? What about when the Kingdom of Acre itself had fallen, could some of the families eventually made their way there? (And at that stage its rather difficult to even consider them Franks..)



There is plenty of evidence of Cuman soldiers (Caucasian, light coloured hair and blue or green eyes) in Russia both prior to and after the Mongol invasions of the 13th Century. Georgia, at that time, would have been one of the Russian states I think.

Georgia is also in the Caucasus, home of the Caucasian race.

I'd like to see the results of DNA studies before going much further.

Edited by toyomotor - 28 Feb 2014 at 20:16
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