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JonyBandana ![]() Janissary ![]() ![]() Joined: 24 Jun 2018 Location: Argentina Status: Offline Points: 19 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Posted: 24 Jun 2018 at 12:40 |
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Disclaimer: This is not a stupid question. Ok, so my basic question is: How can one know about everything, without knowing everything when it comes to history? At first glance it seems stupid, but let me give you an example: The gunpowder plot was a really interesting event in history, yet not everyone knows about it, because the only ways to know are:
I'm sure there are more ways, but you get the idea. So basically what I want know, is there a book (textbook or not) that can give you a general idea of the most influential things that happened throughout history, or at least large periods of it? Something that doesn't go into unnecesary details, yet it tells you the gist of it all, in case you want to investigate more. That's basically it. Thanks for any help you can provide! Edited by toyomotor - 24 Jun 2018 at 20:49 |
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Once upon a time books called Encyclopaedia provided us with a fairly good grasp on many subjects, but they were always out of date before they were published.
These days we have the internet, the greatest collection of information, to which we all basically have access, that the world has ever seen, and even the net is not up to date. People will always explore that which puzzles or interests them, and so we gain knowledge that we may not ever need or use, but it's there in our brain, for the day that we do want it. Question: "How much do you know?" Answer: "About what?" Question: "Anything," And there's only one answer. "I don't know." So, Google it!
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JonyBandana ![]() Janissary ![]() ![]() Joined: 24 Jun 2018 Location: Argentina Status: Offline Points: 19 |
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@toyomotor: Thanks for the reply. I see what you mean, but how do I look for things that I don't know exist? I believe that's one of the reasons why books exist. As an example, I like computer science. Recently I bought a book called "Computer Science: An overview". The first thing you read is this:
Is there something like that for history?
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Vanuatu ![]() Administrator ![]() ![]() Joined: 24 Feb 2015 Location: New England Status: Offline Points: 2884 |
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If you are studying on your own it might be helpful to focus on authoritative sources that will lead you to individuals.
Individuals and the branches of their influence expand the view further. Looking at a who's who in computer science and cross referencing authors help subject by subject. Find an outline and exhaust your understanding of each topic, Lastly, keep coming back and share your questions here between us we have something valuable to offer on many subjects. I admire your self motivated pursuit of knowledge. |
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Still round the corner there may wait, a new road or a secret gate. (J. R. R. Tolkien)
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JonyBandana ![]() Janissary ![]() ![]() Joined: 24 Jun 2018 Location: Argentina Status: Offline Points: 19 |
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@Vanuatu: Thanks for your reply and kind words! I'm not sure I understand your post. I don't want to study the history of computer science, I wan to learn more about the history of the world. I'll continue my Guy Fawkes example: When I read the comic "V for Vendetta" I wanted to know: ![]() ![]() After that I started wondering, how many like him are out there that I don't know about, yet others do? How can I find this exemplary humans? Then I came to the conclussion that googling everything was impossible since I didn't know what to look for, and googling "awesome humans that lived in the past" would land me in a never ending cascade of sensasionalist articles, so I though a book (or even better, a textbook) would be the way to go. In short, I'm looking for a book called "Someone. History of the World: An Overview. 999th ed., Humanity, 2019.", and I wanted to know if you guys had any recommendations. (By the way, it doesn't need to be in spanish.)
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Vanuatu ![]() Administrator ![]() ![]() Joined: 24 Feb 2015 Location: New England Status: Offline Points: 2884 |
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hahaha you might get used to it.
Then it's Oxford for history in my opinion. The Oxford Handbook of World History presents thirty-one articles by leading historians on the most important issues explored by contemporary world historians. These broadly fall into four categories: conceptions of the global past, themes in world history, processes of world history, and regions in world history. Oxford Handbook of World History - Oxford Handbooks www.oxfordhandbooks.com/view/10.1093/oxfordhb/9780199235810.001.0001/oxfordh��� *there are free versions of Oxford handbooks online Edited by Vanuatu - 25 Jun 2018 at 21:58 |
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Still round the corner there may wait, a new road or a secret gate. (J. R. R. Tolkien)
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franciscosan ![]() WorldHistoria Master ![]() Joined: 09 Feb 2015 Location: Littleton CO Status: Offline Points: 10947 |
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I like "Who was When? A Dictionary of Contemporaries" by Mirriam Allen de Ford, The H.W Wilson Company NY 1950.
It is a charts of years listed down, starting with 500 BC, 495 BC... and then categories like Government and Law, Military and Naval Affairs, Philosophy and Religion, Science and Medicine, Literature, Painting and Sculpture, etc. across. for the boxes there are names of person/people and beside them usually b. or d. (or fl. for flourish??). It is fun to see who was contemporary with who. What you don't know can be as important as what you do know, because knowing <some thing> can block you from learning <some thing> else. For example, it used to be that it was assumed you had to learn Latin before you learned ancient Greek. But now with people learning ancient Greek before learning Latin, one can see that people used to have blinders on, a Latin filter about what ancient Greek culture was, and now people without that filter are learning new things about ancient Greek culture. If you don't know something at all, you can't learn it (you don't know it exists), and if you do know something, you can't learn it (because you already know it). It is just in a very interest position of knowing enough, including that you don't know (it) that you can learn (it). Oxford defines modern history as anything after the Norman invasion (seriously). |
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JonyBandana ![]() Janissary ![]() ![]() Joined: 24 Jun 2018 Location: Argentina Status: Offline Points: 19 |
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Sorry for the late response. Between the world cup, college,
Fallout 4 and Netflix I don't even have time to open my browser. Except
when my homepage is Netflix. Heh, just kidding. My homepage is YouTube. Anyways, @Vanuatu:
Thanks for the recommendation. I've been looking into that book and
found a PDF version (not even sure if it's supposed to be free, but what
the heck, I just want to check it out). It has a very strange format. It's definitely not what I'm used to. I'm going to write it down as an alternative, but I don't know if it's for me. I don't think it's bad, but would it kill them to add a few images? ![]() Learning alone is hard enough! However, from all the research I've done, it seems like the best candidate. By
the way, I think something happened to your link, so this is the real
one:
http://www.oxfordhandbooks.com/view/10.1093/oxfordhb/9780199235810.001.0001/oxfordhb-9780199235810
. @franciscosan: That seems like something I'd
be interested in. Sadly, the book seems rather unpopular. I don't think
it'd be easy to get it in Argentina. In spanish or otherwise. I found a similar website though. Very nice project.
I agree. That's why I want a book. It can tell me what's out there, so I can later research further if I'm interested. --- I'll
keep looking and come back to ask your opinions. In the meantime I'll
read the Oxford book and see if that's what I'm looking for.
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Vanuatu ![]() Administrator ![]() ![]() Joined: 24 Feb 2015 Location: New England Status: Offline Points: 2884 |
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Hi With Oxford, research encyclopedias, archaic texts and scholarly reviews have a library format and Oxford expects you to register and probably pay for content but searching under Oxford by subject will produce information and images.
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Still round the corner there may wait, a new road or a secret gate. (J. R. R. Tolkien)
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Regardless of how much you read or listen to, no human being can know everything-ever!
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JonyBandana ![]() Janissary ![]() ![]() Joined: 24 Jun 2018 Location: Argentina Status: Offline Points: 19 |
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@Vanuatu: Yes it seems that way. Anyways I was trying to determine if I was gonna buy it or not, so not harm done.
@toyomotor: I agree. That's why I said
I just want to read from someone who knows a lot, who, in turn, read from someone like that as well. It's not everything, but it's a start :)
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JonyBandana ![]() Janissary ![]() ![]() Joined: 24 Jun 2018 Location: Argentina Status: Offline Points: 19 |
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Hi guys. I know it's been a long time, but I found this great book and I thought of the forum. Maybe someone will come looking for the same and find this thread and the book. I found this book on world history which is great and covers lots of topics, while being reasonably short. The book is called "Glencoe World History." I bought the digital edition and will copy and paste the contents in case anyone is interested.
Thanks everyone!
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The book index cannot open as it's not in the form of a link. The index is of no value because we can't access the contents.
How about posting your thoughts about the book's contents?
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JonyBandana ![]() Janissary ![]() ![]() Joined: 24 Jun 2018 Location: Argentina Status: Offline Points: 19 |
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Sorry? I don't know what you meant about the link thing. Also, I don't think I'm capable of reviewing the contents since I haven't even started reading it. The book covers some very interesting topics and has some cool features. For example, a map of the distribution of the major languages, the evolution of the English language, a distribution of religions, a brief description of each one, etc. Basically, the "index of features" takes about 4 pages. Some of the features go from understanding maps to understanding statistics, making desicions, comparisons, distinguishing between fact and opinion, using email, evaluating a website, among a large variety of actual history topics, of course. Honestly, it has so much stuff that it's hard to describe. It's unlike any textbook I've seen. The whole Glencoe series are this way. It's a shame they seem to have been discontinued.
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By creating a hyperlink, others can access the particular web site.
If I understand you correctly, you're talking about a text book, rather than an internet web site. Sorry, but your post is more advertising than informative. toyomotor Moderator.
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JonyBandana ![]() Janissary ![]() ![]() Joined: 24 Jun 2018 Location: Argentina Status: Offline Points: 19 |
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It is also the answer to my question. It seems you have been partially reading my posts since the beginning of the thread. How is it advertising if the book has been discontinued and I'm not recommending or linking to any particular vendor? Is wanting to discuss the advantages and disadvantages of a particular book advertising? |
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franciscosan ![]() WorldHistoria Master ![]() Joined: 09 Feb 2015 Location: Littleton CO Status: Offline Points: 10947 |
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I am glad Mr. Bandana, that you have found something to be enthusiastic about. I hope that you can read it, in whole or in part, and come back to tell us about it. I would also suggest that you give bibliographical data, so that if someone wants to check it out, they might be able to do so.
[author], Title, (press, place of publication, year), you can also add editors or translators. Such a grand narrative has its advantages and its disadvantages. It can only address the most basic features, it has to sacrifice all nuances because the shortage and generality of the sections. But, it can make a good start.
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franciscosan ![]() WorldHistoria Master ![]() Joined: 09 Feb 2015 Location: Littleton CO Status: Offline Points: 10947 |
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Mr. Bandana, if you weren't advertising, then just say so, and start to discuss the book. I would say that you were promoting the book, and some people might confuse that with advertising. Don't worry about it. It is odd though, to say that you haven't started to read it. Sounds like an experiment with hypertext, being an online book? with added features? I'm not sure what kind of a creature it is. Although from what you say, maybe an extinct creature. Have you gotten a hold of one, can you get a hold of one?
It might be interesting to know _of_ such things, even if they are discontinued.
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I agree with Fransciscosan's latest post. Your post contains no information which can be discussed on the forum.
I also suggest that you read the book and then tell us all about it.
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franciscosan ![]() WorldHistoria Master ![]() Joined: 09 Feb 2015 Location: Littleton CO Status: Offline Points: 10947 |
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This is a history forum, we cannot know everything, but I think one thing we can do is have some key dates as posts to hang our banner from, what are key dates that you like to use?
One I like to use is 480 BC battle of Salamis, before that is the Greek Archaic age, after that is the Greek Classical age. The Attic Tragedian Aeschylus wanted to be remembered for fighting in Salamis.
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doskinas ![]() Janissary ![]() ![]() Joined: 05 Mar 2019 Status: Offline Points: 17 |
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There is no way to know it all. The best bet would be the libraries were you could read all and everything about the history. Of course there are some tools online to explore the History and learn about it. Such as Wikipedia - tho it is not primary source. Also Encyclopedia Britannica. There is also new projects coming out like Everipedia or Historia. Who aim to record the history of these days for the sake of the future. Do check them out.
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Athena ![]() Pretorian ![]() Joined: 04 Jul 2019 Location: Eugene, Oregon Status: Offline Points: 155 |
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There is no one source for history, but history is a matter of point of view and there are many different points of view. A huge problem in Palestine and Israel is they have different schools for their children and each teaches history differently. They will never resolve their conflict as long as the don't share the same history. Even at that, knowledge is not limited to accumulating facts, but understanding the meaning of those facts. Our understanding of that difference changes with our years on earth. Youth is a time of accumulating facts. In our later years we tend to have "ah ha" experiences and a sense of gaining the meaning of all those facts. This google search offers on-line college courses in history and more. Personally I was amazed by how much I could learn of history by reading books about the history of education. This is a totally different point of view for learning of history than reading regular stories of his-story and thinking history is about this person and that person. Books like "A People's History of the United States" by Howard Zinn, tell the counter history story, opposing those in power and emphasizing the role of the average person, the exploited masses. The TV series "Connections" can be found on-line and explains how inventions and discoveries influenced history's evolution. [QUOTE] doskinas There is also new projects coming out like Everipedia or Historia. Who aim to record the history of these days for the sake of the future. Do check them out. [QUOTE] That looks very interesting. Thank you.
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franciscosan ![]() WorldHistoria Master ![]() Joined: 09 Feb 2015 Location: Littleton CO Status: Offline Points: 10947 |
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There is a saying, in (post) modern philosophy, "the map is not the territory" I think part of learning history is taking that to heart. I grew up near the Rocky Mountains, and to me a map was something solid, until I visited Minnesota, the land of a thousand lakes. On the map, there would be a lake with an inlet, but getting there (the water had dropped) and there were two, or so forth. Maybe there was a stream from one to the other.
I enjoyed Connections, I think that is where I heard about the thermos bottle, rocket German connection. If so, that might also be where I heard about Germany's 19th-20th century food problem. I have friends who got into Zinn, never have myself. By counter history, I assume you mean revisionism.
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caldrail ![]() Chieftain ![]() ![]() Joined: 21 Jan 2014 Location: Rushey Platt Status: Offline Points: 1468 |
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It's not possible to know it all, but there are plenty who claim to know better.
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http://www.unrv.com/forum/blog/31-caldrails-blog/
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Remember,
Somewhere in there is some common sense, I think!
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caldrail ![]() Chieftain ![]() ![]() Joined: 21 Jan 2014 Location: Rushey Platt Status: Offline Points: 1468 |
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But who's the more foolish - The Fool, or the fool who listens to him?
I base my life on the teachings of Ben Kenobi. Except the idiot leaping off airborne vehicles that is.
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http://www.unrv.com/forum/blog/31-caldrails-blog/
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Vanuatu ![]() Administrator ![]() ![]() Joined: 24 Feb 2015 Location: New England Status: Offline Points: 2884 |
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Why did Henry the VIII keep Wil Somers around? Why in the opinion of group was the Fool so desired by royalty? This is a world wide phenomenon, the record of court fool starts in China nothing from AU Aborigines as far as I know. Jung said the Fool is one step away from the Trickster, who is one step away from a Savior. But every coin has two sides so we get some evil priests.
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Still round the corner there may wait, a new road or a secret gate. (J. R. R. Tolkien)
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Vanuatu ![]() Administrator ![]() ![]() Joined: 24 Feb 2015 Location: New England Status: Offline Points: 2884 |
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The Fool doesn't look where he's going so he doesn't fear the unknown according to the old French mystics. He can get killed being so unencumbered by thought but fortune favors the bold.
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Still round the corner there may wait, a new road or a secret gate. (J. R. R. Tolkien)
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Athena ![]() Pretorian ![]() Joined: 04 Jul 2019 Location: Eugene, Oregon Status: Offline Points: 155 |
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![]() My sister remembers everything from her point of view and from her point of view she never did anything wrong, but I was a mean sister. That is not how I remember things, but I have very few memories so I can't argue with her about things I don't remember and I sure would not want all her memories! If we can't remember it all and all we know in our own point of view, what we know is very limited.
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franciscosan ![]() WorldHistoria Master ![]() Joined: 09 Feb 2015 Location: Littleton CO Status: Offline Points: 10947 |
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I think that Walter Scott, Ivanhoe does a pretty good job in recognizing the fool. The fool is someone who it is beneath the dignity of the aristocrat to take affront from. Whereas, a confrontation between two aristocrats might result in a duel and someone being killed, the fool can intervene and diffuse the situation. There is also a tradition in Orthodox Christianity, of holy fools. I think that on occasion Jewish prophets might function in a similar way.
There is a science fiction short story by Spider Robinson called, "Melancholy Elephants."
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