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Interesting facts about Ashkenazi Jews

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    Posted: 22 Apr 2011 at 19:41
According to Wikipedia, about %25 of the US science Nobel prize winers and more than %50 of world chess champions are Ashkenazi Jews, which seems quite interesting to me because the ratios are incredibly high for such a small ethnic group.

What do you think of the reason behind this? Wikipedia article says it is because of the high IQ rates among Ashkenazi Jews.



Edited by The Hidden Face - 22 Apr 2011 at 19:43
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Al Jassas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2011 at 20:07

Connecting IQ with genes is a very slippery slope. The average IQ for aboriginal Aussies is so low it is classified as mentally retarded so I have no faith in IQ studies, IQ itself or their supposed connection with genes.

 
Now to the other subject, Ashkenazi intelligence. Almost all the ashkenazi laureates have one thing in common (other than being jews), they were damn wealthy. Einstein didn't have to get a real job until he was 25 spending al the prior years getting quality education at exclusive institution. Same story goes for most other jewish laureats.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote drgonzaga Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2011 at 21:17
What is this...a trick question from an application for MENSA membership? After all, one could state that over 90% of Nobel Laureates are men consequently such is stark proof that men are obviously more intelligent than women--must be that y-chromosome!
 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote drgonzaga Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2011 at 21:19
My word! I've just been crowned "King"...the Moderators must have received the results of my DNA test!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Hidden Face Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Apr 2011 at 21:33
Thanks guys for the inputs. By the way I would like to express that the thread is not intended to support the claim that the achievements of Askhenazi Jews are because of their relatively "high IQ". In fact I am asking you to think what would be the real reasons and why you think so. 

DrGonzaga, I think there is also a reason why %90 of Nobel Laureates are men, but that's another issue. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pinguin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Apr 2011 at 02:18
For me it is simple. Something in the culture of the Askhenazi Jews leads them to follow the careers and fields that give nobel prizes, more than to other cultures. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gcle2003 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Apr 2011 at 10:24
al Jassas has a point about wealth, at least bourgeois wealth. After all, analyse Nobel winners by economic class and I guess the result would be overwhelmingly bourgeois with a sprnkiling of relations of the aristocracy (Russell for instance).
 
However it just ducks the point of the original queston, which could be reformulated as 'how come such a high proportion of Ashkenazi Jews apparently got to be bourgeois?'
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Al Jassas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Apr 2011 at 11:37
Actually the most correct question should be why yiddish/German-speaking ashkenazi jews originating from German/Russian areas are overrepresented. The percentage of indeginous (pre-pogrom/pre-holocaust) British and French Jews is not that high. 
 
 
Because they pioneered fields that very few before them did and the primary field was finance.
 
Lets be honest, the most prominant financiers of the world from the mid 18th century onwards were jews, their Sephardi cousins already dominated the field of finance in the Ottoman empire and the middle east for centuries before. There was a social stigma for people working in finance everywhere, there was even a greater social stigma for working under jewish bosses which made employing jews more convenient and finance as everyone knows is a very rewarding business.
 
Jewellers, brass makers (in the middle east at least) and several other occupations were looked down upon by both christians and muslims so jews picked it up though not as exclusively as finance.
 
This was just the beginning. After the French revolution attitudes towards jews greatly relaxed especially in the field of education. Now they can practice law (another less respectable high income), stock brokers, tradesmen, insurance, and other businesses classified as middle class. However it was the emphasis on obtaining top quality education that preoccuied jews. While middle class christians spent their money apprenticing their children a good majority of jews spent it on education.
 
I remember reading an astonishing census report on Poland written sometime in the 30s, jews (and to a lesser extent Germans) who formed nearly 15% of the Polish population were literally the middle/upper class. The percentage of lawyers, professors and doctors in both minorities were in the upper 60s% all the way to 90%. Only teachers had a higher percentage of Poles than the other two minorities. This tells alot.
 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote drgonzaga Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Apr 2011 at 21:08
Well, Al Jassas, wouldn't any claim about Poland in the 1930s be skewered as a result of its absorption of territories that already has a bourgeois population associated with the German and Austrian Empires until 1919? Besides, anyone should be properly nervous when discussing banking and Jews since such skirts too closely to the Shylock Syndrome--not to mention NAZI mythology. That is not saying that much of this propaganda is not premised on salient facts. And often it is a Jewish writer that promotes the image. Here is a perfect example from the world of the Internet:
 
 
Notice how this wingnut site utilizes the Sachar book to warp the historical narrative.


Edited by drgonzaga - 23 Apr 2011 at 21:08
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Al Jassas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Apr 2011 at 21:27
Hello Doc
 
The only German majority region of Poland in the 30s was Gdansk, The corridor and Breslau and the total German population was close to 700k only. Most jews were from the former Russian empire part of Poland where German was the language of education and culture not Russian. Most Polish middle/upper classes were either in political opposition or military though a few (mostly impovirshed) chose science (Maria Sklodowska aka Marie Curie).
 
Now about Jews in finance. I think I mentioned that jews pioneered the field but didn't dominate it. The Rothschilds for example pioneered international banking by establishing banking chains across the world and becoming the bankers of states but were far from being alone (though at one time they and another jewish banker made the majority of international loans thanks to Egypt and the Ottoman empire).
 
Again, I think the more interesting question is why those scientists came from highly urbanised German speaking/influenced areas and not from the Shtetls of Belarus and Galicia?
 
 
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Edited by Al Jassas - 23 Apr 2011 at 21:29
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote opuslola Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 May 2011 at 22:31
Perhaps the most important part of the last post by drgonzaga, is the use of the over worn word "NAZI!, as it seems exists within the very name of a Jewish group the "As-khe-nazi!"

Does this this symbolism fortell something?

It mostly reminds me of one of my favorite movies, which is called "THE PRODUCERS", staring Zero Mostel.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zero_Mostel

"Come and join the Nazi party" Laugh!

"Bialystock and Bloom!" LOL (large blonde Norwegian)

Perhaps it is one of your favorites also?

Note the spelling is incorrect above it should be "Ashkenazi!" Sorry.

Edited by opuslola - 07 May 2011 at 18:28
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gcle2003 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 May 2011 at 11:59
Originally posted by opuslola opuslola wrote:

Perhaps the most important part of the last post by drgonzaga, is the use of the over worn word "NAZI!, as it seems exists within the very name of a Jewish group the "As-khe-nazi!"

Does this this symbolism fortell something?
No.
 
It's spelt 'Ashkenazi' by-the-by..

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote opuslola Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 May 2011 at 23:11
Graham wrote;

"It's spelt 'Ashkenazi' by-the-by.."

I certainly thought that I had already responded to Graham's post above. Perhaps I am being ?

But, thanks for the correction Graham! I only hope I will be able to do the same for you sometime.

What is the strange thing about our little conflicts, is the fact that politically, it seems that both you and the "good doctor",and I, are mostly in agreement!

This seems to be some anomaly of some kind?

Just how could we argue like dogs and cats, when in the politic, we are more like "puppies at the teat?"

There was an old cartoon show on TV, at least here in the USA, that had a similar programme.   I believe its name was "The Ruff and Ready Show"?

"We're ruff and ready, always tough and steady, sometimes we have our little spats, we even have our in's and out's, but when we need each other that's when, we're ruff and ready!"

Good memory, what?

Regards,

Oh! For the Doc, I would just like to say that the made for TV special, starring the songs of one of my favorite musicians, with the good name of Harry Nilsson, and with the narration of one of America's "big stars who might well win an Oscar", I.e., Ringo Starr, that produced a big hit on the really good FM radio stations back then.

The name of the made for TV special was, of course, "The Point!", as the good Doc obviously "Knows so well!"

Say, why don't we all play a little "ring toss?"



Perhaps "Arrow" will no longer be a Chrysler product? And, I will become Oblio?

Regards to both of you!

http://www.bing.com/music/albums/detail?q=Harry+Nilsson+The+Point!&albumID=D5351600-0100-11DB-89CA-0019B92A3933&artistID=A8130000-0600-11DB-89CA-0019B92A3933&FORM=DTPMUO

P.S, while I live in Mobile, AL, in 1974-75, it was not abnormal for our elite radio stations to play the entire score of the Album at one time without interruptions.

So; "Just think about your troubles?"

Edited by opuslola - 13 May 2011 at 23:39
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gcle2003 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 May 2011 at 11:46
Originally posted by opuslola opuslola wrote:

Graham wrote;

"It's spelt 'Ashkenazi' by-the-by.."

I certainly thought that I had already responded to Graham's post above. Perhaps I am being ?

But, thanks for the correction Graham! I only hope I will be able to do the same for you sometime.

What is the strange thing about our little conflicts, is the fact that politically, it seems that both you and the "good doctor",and I, are mostly in agreement!
God forbid!
 
I've yet to agree with anything political you've ever posted, including especially your post to the Latinos against Obama thread at
and your awful contributions to the thread on democracy in Egypt
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote opuslola Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 May 2011 at 18:59
Dear Grahm, just which one of the three or four postings I made here;

http://www.allempires.net/forum/latinos-against-obama_topic126562_post58824.html#58824

Did you disagree with?

And the same I ask you to deal with here;


http://www.allempires.net/forum/the-democratic-revolution-in-egypt_topic126568_post58865.html#58865

Just what did I post at the above site, that makes you so mad?

Perhaps you merely mis-understood my words?

"God forbid" you do not respond. chuckle

Regards,


Edited by opuslola - 14 May 2011 at 19:00
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gcle2003 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 May 2011 at 19:46
Originally posted by opuslola opuslola wrote:

Dear Grahm, just which one of the three or four postings I made here;

http://www.allempires.net/forum/latinos-against-obama_topic126562_post58824.html#58824

Did you disagree with?
 
You wrote: "This entire site is a mismash of mostly crud. Besides a few posts, and one especially made by SEKO, most of the rest is based upon aimless retorts, and unsupported accusations."
Quote
And the same I ask you to deal with here;


http://www.allempires.net/forum/the-democratic-revolution-in-egypt_topic126568_post58865.html#58865

Just what did I post at the above site, that makes you so mad?
The opening one that starts "No matter how the media has played it up, the revolution in Egypt, portrayed as a general democratic up-rising, is now turning into an anti-christian uprising, with Christians and their churches being attacked and burned on a regular basis."
Which is simply a biasses and prejudiced piece of nonsense.
 
And the post that starts "It was not caused by Christians?"
 
Quote

Perhaps you merely mis-understood my words?
Don't think so. Would you care to explain how they could possibly issue from an objective, unbiassed mind?
Quote
"God forbid" you do not respond. chuckle
Why not? Pavlovan reflex at the idea anyone should think I agreed with you on either theme. 

[/QUOTE]
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote opuslola Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 May 2011 at 22:55
Dear Graham, I have deleted some of the words you found objectional in the first instance. I hope this helps.

But as regards your statement here;

The opening one that starts "No matter how the media has played it up, the revolution in Egypt, portrayed as a general democratic up-rising, is now turning into an anti-christian uprising, with Christians and their churches being attacked and burned on a regular basis."
Which is simply a biasses and prejudiced piece of nonsense.

And the post that starts "It was not caused by Christians?""

Do you deny the recent reports indicating that some Muslims have already started attacking Christians? Are you not afraid it will just grow and grow?

So, I will stand by my remarks made there.

Regards,
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote drgonzaga Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2011 at 02:19
Only someone blatantly ignorant of Egypt's history could place the internecine rivalries of Egyptian society so outrageously out of context.

Edited by drgonzaga - 07 Jun 2011 at 02:35
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gcle2003 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2011 at 11:56
Originally posted by opuslola opuslola wrote:

Do you deny the recent reports indicating that some Muslims have already started attacking Christians? Are you not afraid it will just grow and grow?
No.
Quote
So, I will stand by my remarks made there.
Feel free. Just don't claim that I in any way whatsoever agree with you. If by some happenstance I one day should, I'll say so.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hebrewtext Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2011 at 13:37
Originally posted by The Hidden Face The Hidden Face wrote:

According to Wikipedia, about %25 of the US science Nobel prize winers and more than %50 of world chess champions are Ashkenazi Jews, which seems quite interesting to me because the ratios are incredibly high for such a small ethnic group.

What do you think of the reason behind this? Wikipedia article says it is because of the high IQ rates among Ashkenazi Jews.


the figures get to 30%-50 % of all the science and medicine Nobel winers were Jews (or "mixed" Jews)  ,  while their precantage of the world pop.  is about  0.2 %.


the same go's also for :

world's politicians
world's revolutionaries
world's bankers and wealth
world's media
and more fields



Edited by Hebrewtext - 15 May 2011 at 13:42
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dolphin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 May 2011 at 13:55
Originally posted by Hebrewtext Hebrewtext wrote:

Originally posted by The Hidden Face The Hidden Face wrote:

According to Wikipedia, about %25 of the US science Nobel prize winers and more than %50 of world chess champions are Ashkenazi Jews, which seems quite interesting to me because the ratios are incredibly high for such a small ethnic group.

What do you think of the reason behind this? Wikipedia article says it is because of the high IQ rates among Ashkenazi Jews.


the figures get to 30%-50 % of all the science and medicine Nobel winers were Jews (or "mixed" Jews)  ,  while their precantage of the world pop.  is about  0.2 %.


the same go's also for :

world's politicians
world's revolutionaries
world's bankers and wealth
world's media
and more fields


Obvious comeback removed Smile



Edited by Dolphin - 15 May 2011 at 14:44
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Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Hidden Face Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Jun 2011 at 01:12
Opuslola, Al-Jassas is our veteran member and I am not aware of any of his anti Jewish attitude. He seems to be very educated and I have learned a lot from his posts.



Originally posted by Hebrewtext Hebrewtext wrote:

Originally posted by The Hidden Face The Hidden Face wrote:

According to Wikipedia, about %25 of the US science Nobel prize winers and more than %50 of world chess champions are Ashkenazi Jews, which seems quite interesting to me because the ratios are incredibly high for such a small ethnic group.

What do you think of the reason behind this? Wikipedia article says it is because of the high IQ rates among Ashkenazi Jews.


the figures get to 30%-50 % of all the science and medicine Nobel winers were Jews (or "mixed" Jews)  ,  while their precantage of the world pop.  is about  0.2 %.


the same go's also for :

world's politicians
world's revolutionaries
world's bankers and wealth
world's media
and more fields


That's wonderful. And I know that Jews are also known for their success stories in banking and politics. Though I would like to make a distinction between Ashkenazi Jews and Sephardi Jews or any other ethnic Jewish groups. I am not really impressed with the achievements of Sephardi Jews for instance, keeping in mind that they are as wealthy as Ashkenazi Jews.

One note we seem to forget about Ashkenazi Jews is also impressive, %50 of World Chess champions are Ashkenazi Jews! I am speechless. As I am interested in chess I know how unbelievebly talented those players are.

 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cywr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Jun 2012 at 20:16
Maybe it was their protestant work ethic...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Woofer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Sep 2013 at 12:38
What a pity.there are only 11 Nobel prize winners from Sephardic Jewish backgrounds. How shamed they must feel.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pinguin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 2013 at 03:53
Don't be silly. Sephardi Jews have their own glorious history.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Woofer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 2013 at 08:49
Originally posted by pinguin pinguin wrote:

Don't be silly. Sephardi Jews have their own glorious history.


Since You are Argentinian you fail to spot English Irony. 13 Nobel prizes in science is more than the Muslim world and africa combined.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pinguin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 2013 at 15:13
Originally posted by Woofer Woofer wrote:


Since You are Argentinian you fail to spot English Irony. 13 Nobel prizes in science is more than the Muslim world and africa combined.


Ha ha, very funny Confused

Besides, don't forget that to produce Nobel prizes in mass you need subsidies of generous governments, like the U.S., Germany, France and few others. That's not something widespread worldwide, so Nobel prizes in science aren't widespread either. For instance, all the Nobel prizes in science of Spain and Latin America made theirs carriers abroad.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eetion Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Feb 2014 at 19:51
Nobel Prize? It is just an award from a good university so there is not a real global election so if Cairo or Bejing was giving prizes, I don't think that Ashkenazi Jews would be that much succesfull
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Penderyn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jan 2016 at 14:36
I'd guess that the Ashkenazi were a splendid genetic mix of Khazar with Semites with Slavs as allsorts got converted to the religion of a culturally superior people, who were then persecuted viciously to give them an incentive to get bright fast, which so mixed a people are set up to do.    They've done well, fair play, those who survived!
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