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The origin of Jin and Qing dynasty

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    Posted: 04 Nov 2009 at 07:00
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Edited by altaicmania - 11 Nov 2011 at 15:33
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brainsucker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Nov 2009 at 14:49

I just curious. if the Jin and Qing empire were truely the decendant of Kim Ham-bo just as some Korean claim, then it should have been stated from long time ago by various Jin and Qing historical books. I think saying that Jurchen was the decendant of korean people won't hurt the Manchurian's proudness as a race (if it true)

But because this information come from Korea, and there is no cross preference from other sources (from Manchu for instance), then me, as an outsider will think that it is a Korean propaganda to discredit the Manchurian People.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sarmat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Nov 2009 at 01:38
Moved to alternative history.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sarmat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Nov 2009 at 02:55
Originally posted by Brainsucker Brainsucker wrote:

I just curious. if the Jin and Qing empire were truely the decendant of Kim Ham-bo just as some Korean claim, then it should have been stated from long time ago by various Jin and Qing historical books. I think saying that Jurchen was the decendant of korean people won't hurt the Manchurian's proudness as a race (if it true)

But because this information come from Korea, and there is no cross preference from other sources (from Manchu for instance), then me, as an outsider will think that it is a Korean propaganda to discredit the Manchurian People.
 
It's exactly what you say Brainsucker, poorly drafted fantastic Korean propaganda. It were Qing Manchu emperors who submitted Korea, not Koreans that founded Jin and Qing dynasties.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Brainsucker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Nov 2009 at 14:47

The problem of this matter is that because the claims come from Korea, not Manchurian. It is different to the Indonesian who claim that they came from Yunnan, China. We can believe of the Indonesia ancestry who came from Yunnan because it is themselves who said about it. But, the Jin and Qing matter is come from Korean, so outside people will think that this claim is an attempt to rob another people history to discredit them. If I am a Manchu, I will become angry because of this.



Edited by Brainsucker - 07 Nov 2009 at 14:48
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Jun 2012 at 09:51
The origin of the Qing was the assumed power of Aisin Gioro Nurhaci, who was crowned Khan of the Later Jin Dynasty while the Ming was to the south. At the end of the Ming, Aisin Gioro Fu Lin declared himself emperor of China, titled Shunzi Tongbao, and given the posthumous name of Huangdi Titian Longyun Dingtong Jianji Yingrui Qinwen Xianwu Dade Honggong Zhiren Chunxiao Zhang. I am not sure about the origin of the Jin, but although the Qing has power over China as imperial pretendance, the manchu names of nobility for Aisin Gioro became obsolite. Now the Qing is the family name of Jin becaus the head of the clan, Aisin Gioro Pu Ren, changed his name into the chinese Jin Youzhi.
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