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Turks with Kurdish origins

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    Posted: 20 Jun 2009 at 18:38
Originally posted by calvo calvo wrote:

While in the media we often hear of the struggle between Kurdish separatists and the Turkish government; there is another phenomenon that few people have addressed: the assimilation of Kurds into the Turkish ethnicity.
 
What I mean is: are there many Turkish nationals, who feel, think, and consider themselves as "Turkish", actually of Kurdish family origin?
If there are many, then how do they live with their dual identity? What is their typical political stance on the Turkish-Kurdish conflict?

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Zagros View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Zagros Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Jun 2009 at 21:34
I have met two types of Kurd from Turkey.

1. Completely hates the state of Turkey
2. Considers himself Kurdish but a citizen of Turkey

The latter have been drastically fewer in number, but I have only come across these individuals in Europe, so obviously many will be of the first variety.

Though there are many Turks (millions) whom  generations ago will have been Kurds but now consider themselves Turk.  In fact it is obvious to me which those are when I see them from their features.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote calvo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Jun 2009 at 10:29
Rather than the political issues of independence, do Kurds and Turks in Turkey differ considerably in everyday customs and beliefs? Would there be any culture clashes?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eaglecap Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 2009 at 20:17
A lot of the Turks I met in Istanbul were of Kurdish origin but they still considered themselves very Turkish. I do not fully understand this issue for Kurdish independence but using terror against the general Turkish population is wrong and the Kurds I met would agree with me. My friends in the USA would hear about a bombing in Turkiye before I did and were, while there, in other parts of Turkiye.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Zagros Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 2009 at 20:27
Originally posted by calvo calvo wrote:

Rather than the political issues of independence, do Kurds and Turks in Turkey differ considerably in everyday customs and beliefs? Would there be any culture clashes?


It's like asking do French and Austrians differ much in customs and belief... perhaps not so much but they are still distinctly different people.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eaglecap Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 2009 at 20:49
Originally posted by calvo calvo wrote:

Rather than the political issues of independence, do Kurds and Turks in Turkey differ considerably in everyday customs and beliefs? Would there be any culture clashes?


I do not know about the Kurds on the Iraq border but the ones I met in Istanbul were very Turkish culturally and most are also Muslim. I did meet some who were agnostic or athiest but so are many of the secular Turks. In the city I was really impressed with the unity of Turks no matter what their ethnic makeup was. I remember thinking how much I would like to see this in the USA. I would only dream of the day when Americans can look at other Americans, no matter their race, and say greeting fellow American.   I saw no huge separation with the Kurds culturally from other Turks and I saw many faces. Even as an ethnic Greek all I can give the Turks today is praise for their cultural unity. Although, I was only there for five months, and I do not know what it is like outside of Istanbul. Is a difference outside of Istanbul?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote calvo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Jun 2009 at 08:27
Do Turkified Kurds face any discrimination in Turkey? Or would they face discrimination from Kurds for being traitors?

Here is an interesting story:
I once knew an Iranian guy of Kurdish origin. He was on holiday in Istanbul when he got mugged while strolling through a dark street at night. He somewhat realised that the muggers were Kurdish, so he spoke Kurdish to them. Surprisingly, the muggers let him go without taking anything.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote eaglecap Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Jun 2009 at 18:41
Originally posted by calvo calvo wrote:

Do Turkified Kurds face any discrimination in Turkey? Or would they face discrimination from Kurds for being traitors?Here is an interesting story:I once knew an Iranian guy of Kurdish origin. He was on holiday in Istanbul when he got mugged while strolling through a dark street at night. He somewhat realised that the muggers were Kurdish, so he spoke Kurdish to them. Surprisingly, the muggers let him go without taking anything.


It is an interesting question but while in Istanbul I did not see this but five months is not really long enough to know the culture or the people. I did see discrimination towards the gypsies but with the Kurds I did not see this. In my classrooms I saw mutual respect between Turks, Kurds and European Turks- came from Bulgaria, Bosnia etc. It could have been because my students were mature, college educated and professionals; on the most part. Maybe on the streets it was different but only a Kurd or Turk in Turkiye can answer this correctly.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bulldog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Jun 2009 at 20:30
Quote Calvo
Do Turkified Kurds face any discrimination in Turkey? Or would they face discrimination from Kurds for being traitors?

 
Turks who are of Kurdish origin or have some Kurdish connection don't face discrimination as they are Turks, I know it may sound strange but Turkey has a very inclusive society ie you could be black but if you perceived yourself to be a Turk and spoke Turkish your accepted like any other Turk. There are Turks or Albanian, Bosnian, Cherkhez, Chechen origin but there is no difference in Turkishness between them.

However, this doesn't make Turkey the most tolerant place either to people who want to be different different arn't as accepted, only recently Kurds have been granted cultural and language rights.

The problem is mainly a cause of state policies, your average Joe is pretty relaxed and doesn't really care what ethnic a person is.

Then there are mixed families, I have a friend whose mother is Kurdish, she speaks Kurdish with her side of the family. He is pro-Turkey, pro-Kurd and pro-Turk LOL


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bulldog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Jun 2009 at 20:36
Quote Calvo/

Rather than the political issues of independence, do Kurds and Turks in Turkey differ considerably in everyday customs and beliefs? Would there be any culture clashes?


It depends were you go.

In the major cities which have Turkish majorities were Kurds have lived for generations there are hardly no differences. Infact Turks and Kurds from that area/city would have more differences than Turks in another region.

In majority Kurdish areas there are some cultural differences, there is still a tribal system in some areas, its not just a Kurdish thing, there are Turkish/Turkmen and Arab tribes aswell but mostly they are Kurdish. The tribes have their own codes.

I wouldn't say there is a culture clash, there isn't a huge difference culturally between alot of the old Ottoman regions, through to Iran and the settled regions of Central Asia.

But like Zagros said, across parts of Europe there are common cultural aspect but it doesn't make everybody the same people.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pebbles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Jul 2009 at 11:02
 
Why the Turks insist that they're descended from Central Asian nomadic Turkic people,as many facts now reveal vast majority of their ancestors were local tribes of Anatolia,Armenians,Kurds,Greeks and other Caucasus people Confused
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote calvo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Jul 2009 at 14:26
Originally posted by pebbles pebbles wrote:

 
Why the Turks insist that they're descended from Central Asian nomadic Turkic people,as many facts now reveal vast majority of their ancestors were local tribes of Anatolia,Armenians,Kurds,Greeks and other Caucasus people Confused


This is the last time I explain this to you: ethnicity and national identity are defined by linguistic, cultural, and historical affinities, rather than genetics.
Most inhabitants in modern England are descended from the native Celtic tribes rather than the Anglo-Saxon invaders (who were a small minority). However, the English identity is Anglo-Saxon based on language and culture.
Following the same argument, Spaniards, French, Portuguese, Italians, and Rumanians are mostly descended from the indigenous populations of the region rather than the "Latin Romans" who conquered them; yet culturally speaking, these countries are LATIN COUNTRIES.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Easternbul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Aug 2009 at 12:38
Yes,i know that i have descends from the Balkan,Crimea and the Caucasus but my culture is turkish so i am calling myself turk.The ethnicity wasn't important and won't be important in the future.In Germany the most Kurds i know have sympathy for the Pkk.I also know a little minority who are calling themselves as kurdish but are saying that they are citizen or Turkey,Iraq,Iran or Syria.The same with the Turkmens in Syria or Iraq.I saw two types of them too. I never had a problem with Kurds who are speaking kurdish and it is good that they have more rights in Turkey.But we will see what will happening in the future.

Sorry for my bad english :S 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pabbicus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Oct 2009 at 21:38
Am I the only person who considers the Kurdish terrorists to be the "bad guys" in the only islamic state that can reasonably be considered "modern?"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Zagros Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Dec 2009 at 21:15
They are like the IRA with a similarly sympathetic and numerous base of support.  They are not being terrorists for the sake of it.  They have genuine grievances stemming mainly from Turkish fascism. 

Imagine being banned from speaking your own language in your own country.

PS: Turkey is not an 'Islamic state'. It is a secular state, to its fortune.


Edited by Zagros - 01 Dec 2009 at 21:16
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote xristar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Dec 2009 at 22:12
Originally posted by Zagros Zagros wrote:


PS: Turkey is not an 'Islamic state'. It is a secular state, to its fortune.

He propably meant "muslim state".
Is there any thing whereof it may be said, See, this is new?
it hath been already of old time, which was before us.
-Ecclesiastes
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Zagros Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Dec 2009 at 22:54
Regardless of what he meant, Turkey is a secular state.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kalhor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Jan 2010 at 14:21
the kurds in turkey are now most assimilated kurds despite the seize of population. why ?there are many reasons. first is turk's historically tactic of using massive force for liguistic  and ethnic assimillation has been very succesful in many other areas like azerbaijan(please read what TOGHROL did to creat a turkish azarbaijan) in iran and many other places in the asia,then the kurds in turkey choose a wrong path instead of seeking a cultural freedom and more federal solution they follwed an extremist  communist turk like ocalan which by using terror and separatism gave all the reasons needed to the turks to do what they have doneUnhappy  with the kurds.sadly they(kurds) never asked themseleves for what reason a turk communist like ocalan would lead their nation to freedomShocked

Edited by kalhor - 17 Jan 2010 at 21:05
son of Bavand
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