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UFO footage

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franciscosan View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote franciscosan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Aug 2018 at 01:46
The Eastern United States does not appreciate how scarce water is in the West.

I am sure every drop has passed through several dinosaurs (and other critters) over the years.

Ever look at Barlowe's Guide to Extraterrestrials?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote caldrail Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Aug 2018 at 12:53
But the important question is how often do we drink water passed by space aliens? You know, people write books on 'what the space aliens did for us', or 'keep watching the skies!' but no-one seems to delve into the practical issues of alien intrusion in our midst. I mean, if seven ft tall repitilianoids are walking amongst us how come their DNA is never detected in crime scenes? Why do they never have embarrassing incidents like their mask slipping during that all important media call? Why are their spaceships so completely uncontrollable, whizzing of at random angles in an instant? And for that matter, why do some people know about them and the rest of us don't? I mean, are these alien reptile things dating members of the human race? Mind you, it would explain the behaviour of a former girlfriend or two.
http://www.unrv.com/forum/blog/31-caldrails-blog/
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote franciscosan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Aug 2018 at 21:48
So, what you are saying, is why don't aliens have "wardrobe malfunctions" (like Paula Abdul)?  <grin>

Maybe the aliens are just acting like kids spinning around on the merry-go-round?  Or, if you got artificial gravity, then why not move like that?  Of course, if there are aliens (if), then why do we think we could fathom their thinking?  (In one way saying that is a cop out, but on the other hand there might be a great deal of truth to it.)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote caldrail Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Aug 2018 at 13:08
Actually I like the stress you place on alienness - Carl Sagan made similar arguments. As it happens I said the same thing many years ago discussing aliens by pointing out that we could not second guess their motives for what they do, and virtually everything we see and hear about aliens, be it fiction or investigation, is from a human perspective and interpretation. One might however point out that life has an annoying tendency toward convergent evolution, on the grounds that certain solutions in nature are better, thus why would alien evolution be so impossibly different? Then again, as Carl Sagan would have pointed out, that is true for alien species that evolved toward a humanesque stereotype (Star Trek again!) whereas the universe seen from a sentient being that evolved from electrovores on a high gravity hothouse world where the ecology has a different emphasis and interaction would necessarily include variations from our expectations.
 
This of course brings in factors to our discussion that act against the norms of UFO writing. Besides the obvious issues of finding technology that counters obstacles posed by vast distances and physical limits, we run into the most important issue of motivation. Do these aliens want to explore? Study? Conquer? Steal? Consume? Find a human mate and settle down in some strange conspiracy to found a master race? All of these have been considered by human authors and UFO experiencees at one time or another, and they're just the obvious. I guess the problem is that no-one seems to have asked them. I wonder why?


Edited by caldrail - 08 Aug 2018 at 13:10
http://www.unrv.com/forum/blog/31-caldrails-blog/
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Vanuatu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Aug 2018 at 16:28
http://www.foxnews.com/science/2018/08/07/audio-reveals-creepy-details-ufo-mystery.html

Recent find-Audio interview of a head master in 1966 Melbourne, Au. 300 witnessed a "flying saucer." 

From this level of existence we are like bacteria in the intestines, all higher perspective is forever out of our reach and we don't even know what town we live in.Big smile


Edited by Vanuatu - 11 Aug 2018 at 16:29
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote franciscosan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Aug 2018 at 22:56
I disagree, even if there is life elsewhere in the universe, "intelligent life" is probably exceedingly rare and something very special.  (Just don't tell the kids at the coffeehouse, or it will go to their heads).  But, also the importance of life is not just at the species level, but as the organic whole, the ecosystem+  So, I don't think that it would be a good thing to have more people, and less say, penguins or paramecium.  We should also remember that we have a bias towards charismatic mega-fauna, and not necessarily important links in the eco-system.  Hedgehogs are cute, but when they get loose in English bird preserves, they cause problems, and regardless of their fan base, should be treated appropriately.

Of course, I still am all for the theory that we got intergalactic coodies, and there is a giant quarantine around us.  But, every once in awhile, the alien doctors come in and give people an anal probe or turn a cow inside out.  We also must admit the possibility that aliens have a sense of humor, and find us hilarious.  Human comedy consist of looking down on the buffoon, and laughing knowing that that too is us.  Would aliens feel the same way??  Maybe the greatest human import to the rest of the universe, are our sit-coms.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote caldrail Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Aug 2018 at 14:26
Quote I disagree, even if there is life elsewhere in the universe, "intelligent life" is probably exceedingly rare and something very special.
 
It's impossible to know. However, one thing is clear about biology here on Earth. Intelligence is the result of excess brain capacity compared to the creatures body size. That's why corvids (crows, ravens, magpies etc) are such fabulous problem solvers or why great apes show occaisional tool use. Contrary to popular opinion the brain sizes of dinosaurs was not quite as small as most believe. Granted, they weren't the brightest of animals (a typical carnivore might be en par with a modern alligator) but plenty of large mammals were pretty dumb too, elephants excepted.
 
However, the intelligence. problem solving, and guile of animals is not necessarily going to result in the works of Shakespeare or interstellar spacecraft. It also requires manipulative members and sophisticated language. It requires free time to muse and consider as opposed to being fully concerned with survival and chasing that very attractive female. It requires social behaviours and prosperous enviroments, and further, the presence of useful resources that can be ultimately manipulated or worked.
 
As it happens I recall that some researchers have concluded Humanity is in danger of evolving smaller brains. Our easy lifestyles and technological tools are making mental work less strenuous. Use it or lose it. Nature does things that way.
http://www.unrv.com/forum/blog/31-caldrails-blog/
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote franciscosan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Aug 2018 at 21:29
I have got a question (that I don't know the answer of), let us say there is an alien civilization on a planet orbiting a star, let us say that they are of comparable technology, and intellectually curious somewhat like us.  How far away would they have to be, to not detect us with their radio telescopes?  Assume that the issue is not whether a light speed radio transmission would not have reached them yet. (double negative).
How long (and far) have we been able to detect an (exo-)planet lit up with radio waves, like the Earth is, or am exaggerating, how much that is?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote toyomotor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Aug 2018 at 04:01
First, what is the range of our current telescopes/radio telescopes etc?

Second, we can assume nothing.

Third, how do we know that interstellar visitors aren't circling earth at the moment?

Fourth, could it be that we are a colony of some far away inter-galactical life form?

Look at the number of unsolved mysteries that our current scientists still can't explain.

How do we know that one of our space agencies has not identified and contacted some far away life form?

Image result for Radio telescope range


Quote Anyway it's really all for naught because radio waves are completely useless for interstellar communication. They are moving way too slow for any meaningful use. Even the nearest solar system would take 4 years to send a signal and 4 more years to get a reply.
From https://astronomy.stackexchange.com/questions/1032/what-is-the-maximum-transmission-distance-of-the-radio-signal-in-the-outer-space
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote franciscosan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Aug 2018 at 19:52
We can assume many things, in fact we have to come up with working hypotheses in order to explore various theories.
Assuming that there are interstellar visitors circling the Earth is a fairly useless hypothesis.  The hypothesis does not make a difference as far whether it is true or not, unless something is observed, and the hypothesis does not make a difference before such observations (might) happen.

Are we colony?  Well not if you define a colony as being like the new world was for Europe.  The Spanish colonies, for example, are dependent on the Old World for finished goods and government, and supply raw materials.  Slaves also play a role in exploiting the New World, for the benefit of the Old World.  I think we would notice if some kind of commerce like that was going on.  If your model for a "colony" is the Greek poleis (or Phoenician, like Carthage), which were settled in Sicily, Southern Italy and elsewhere, that were independent of their parent cities, except for some similar cult practices, then yes, Earth might be a "colony" in that sense.  Generally, however, scholars these days try to call these the Greek name 'oikomenos,' avoiding the loaded term of "colony."

Well, you are not going to use radio waves on the intergalactic scale like it was a walkie talkie.  But, an alien race might get some knowledge of humans from I Love Lucy and the Flintstones.Wacko
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote toyomotor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Aug 2018 at 14:26
[quote]Assuming that there are interstellar visitors circling the Earth is a fairly useless hypothesis.  The hypothesis does not make a difference as far whether it is true or not, unless something is observed, and the hypothesis does not make a difference before such observations (might) happen.[/quote[

Assuming that interstellar visitors are not circling the Earth is a very useless hypothesis.The hypothesis does not make a difference as far as whether it is true or not.

Numerous and credible sightings of UFOs around the world every year gives us a clue that there is something going on out there. Armed Services and government agencies have vehemently denied being involved in experimentation in this area.

You're a glass half empty person, while I'm (usually) the opposite.

Until such times as there's genuine proof either way I'll maintain an open mind.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote franciscosan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Aug 2018 at 03:43
Actually, that interstellar visitors are not circling the Earth matches the observed data, you can talk about cloaking devices or other such concealment technology, but that is adding a level of complication.  NASA tracks most things larger than a bolt (well maybe not that small, maybe).

But, I wasn't saying that interstellar visitors are not circling the Earth, I was saying you get no mileage out of such a hypothesis.  If you cannot see aliens right now, it is of no use to go out actively looking for them, they know how to play hide much better than we know how to play seek.  Maybe we will notice them along the way, (if they are there), but if we cannot notice them already, doing more of and more intensely the same thing, is probably not going to get different results.

Or of course, we could figure out what, ali-ali-oxenfree! is in galactic, and call it out, in childhood games, that is what was called out when a session of hide-and-go-seek was over, signaling everybody to come out of their hiding places.  When you called it out, you generally were admitting that whoever was still in hiding, were too well hidden for your (my) poor abilities.

Personally, I think angels and demons are just as good (or bad) an explanation of UFOs as aliens are.  Or time or probability travelers.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote toyomotor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Aug 2018 at 09:18
You certainly do march to the beat of a different drum, don't you?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote franciscosan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Aug 2018 at 22:10
Not exactly sure what you are specifically referring to, but yes probably.  A friend says that I wouldn't want to belong to any club that would have me.  
But any (aliens or whatnot) would probably have such a sophisticated level of technology that it would be indistinguishable from magic.  Why shouldn't they be more like angels and demons (saints and villains) than like enlightenment rationalists, who in our day and age, often seem to worship at the altar of science?  In other words, why should aliens "be reasonable," in the way we picture ourselves as reasonable?  Are we really _that_ reasonable that we would think (unconsciously) that aliens would act like us.  I mean if they were more advanced, they probably could imitate us in action, and some extent thought.  Probably.  They probably have gone through a stage of development where they (like us) were worshipful of technology, and they probably have gotten beyond that, unlike us who sometimes act like technology is the answer to all our dreams (and nightmares). 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote caldrail Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Sep 2018 at 12:10
On one British freeview channel we regularly get programs about aliens. Most of it is th most ridiculous assumptions you could possibly make, besides illustrating how much paranoia is still evident in human society. I was particularly struck by one program that discussed how President Dwight Eisenhower signed a contract with the 'Greys', a deal in which America received superior technology in return for abductees.
 
Firstly - this hidden super-technology idea. Really? I mean, if you want to win a game of poker, why would you hide all your best cards? What's the point of accumulating war winning technology if you don't use it in service? It makes no sense whatsoever. Oh. I forgot. It was alien in origin so no-one wants us to knopw it was originally theirs. So how would anyone know that at all if it's such a secret?
 
Secondly - having read a book at my local library that lovingly describes all the various alien races, factions, and relationships current within our galaxy, one has to wonder if someone isn't making fools of us all. Who would know all of this stuff if it was true?
 
Consider this piece I wrote some time ago....
 

Public perception of current affairs is often skewed according to various factors. I remember an Iranian immigrant who was in my engineering class at College in the 80's. He was convinced, completely and absolutely, that the CIA was responsible for every bad thing that happened in the world. I told him that couldn't be the case. There's only so many CIA agents, only so much money to fund their activities, and there's plenty of other agencies at work, never mind the unexpected twists of fate. He simply couldn't understand why I was saying that.

 

That sort of thing isn't unusual. A forklift driver I spoke to a couple of years ago, as british as you can get, had exactly the same beliefs. He could not accept that 9/11 was the work of a slightly amateurish terrorist team. No, he insisted it was CIA black ops, without any inkling of commonsense or understanding of the politics, science, and forensics of the event. Another british warehouseman the same day insisted that the Falkland War was about getting bases in Chile. Pardon me? Well, a serviceman had told him that and it was from the horses mouth as far as he was concerned, never mind the complete implausibility of that particular leg-pull and all the evidence that it was a military expedition to oust Argentine occupation of a British dependency.

 

The reality isn't enough. Some people want to believe they know more than what the media tell us or perhaps more importantly, that they know more than you or I. Now I have to accept that even the western free press isn't entirely honest and objective all of the time, but then, neither are their sources. In some cases, information is withheld to prevent undesirable circumstances, or indeed discoveries that the authorities don't want scrutinised. That's normal security procedure for any country but it doesn't help convince people that the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth is being related.

 

In the search of this kind of 'knowledge advantage' these people will believe anything if it provides an alternative explanation that puts their favourite bugbear into question. The upshot is that if you believe a certain agency is a bad thing, you tend to believe bad things about it. The islamic activists already know this - it's why they press the propaganda button at every opportunity. Hitler had asserted that the bigger the lie, the more people will believe it was true. It must be said he ought to know. However that strategy can backfire. The West never did find evidence of Weapons of Mass Destruction in Iraq.



Edited by caldrail - 03 Sep 2018 at 12:12
http://www.unrv.com/forum/blog/31-caldrails-blog/
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote franciscosan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Sep 2018 at 23:24
There were a few things like a helium lab trailer, that looked promising from satellite photos, but didn't pan out.  But probably the main reason why US (and the rest of the west) was fooled about WMDs was that Iraq was telling UN that they didn't have any WMDs but at the same time they were making noises to Iran like they had WMDs (and US were listening).  And of course, they had used them in the past against Iran and the Kurds.  People like to think that the mistake of believing there were WMDs was much more egregious than it really was.
But in another way it is a good example, things on satellite photos like helium lab trailers, were innocuous things that looked suspicious.  To me a UFO is precisely that, unidentified, but some people cannot take that and have to invent a whole mythology behind it.  I think that it is one thing to acknowledge the unknown, another to read into so much other stuff.  Very human though.
A friend has a DVD of alien autopsy, supposedly from Roswell.  The "scientists" are holding the forceps wrong.


Edited by franciscosan - 03 Sep 2018 at 23:26
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