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Topic ClosedWill the Rapa Nui survive?

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Direct Link To This Post Topic: Will the Rapa Nui survive?
    Posted: 29 Nov 2011 at 10:28
One can wonder if the true polynesian Rapa Nui people will survive in a longer perspective. Because of invading Chileans the percentage of pure Rapa Nuians are steadily diminishing. In 1982 the population on Easter Island consisted of about 70 % polynesians. In 2002 the percentage had sunken to 60 %. If this goes on the Rapa Nuian part of the population will slowly diminish and in worst case they will finally disappear. It is perhaps time for the chilean invaders to move out and leave the island to the true islanders. Chile could leave a skeleton crew for health care, protection and economic aid and exchange but the increase of the chilean elements of the population on the expence of the Rapa Nuians ought to stop. Land on Eastern Island that today belongs to Chileans ought to be given back to the natives. The Chilean colonisation of Easter island is an anacronistic remain of another age and ought to be phased out. 

Edited by Carcharodon - 29 Nov 2011 at 10:34
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 2011 at 13:06
No matter that the Chileans enslaved and killed most of them once upon a time, the important question here is what the Rapa Nui want, not what you think. Did you bother to consult them before deciding upon the course of action?

Edited by Styrbiorn - 29 Nov 2011 at 13:07
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 2011 at 15:20
Actually there are movements among the Rapa Nui for gaining more independance and to get back the land that the Chilans seized from them.
 
Even the UN is concerned about how the Chileans treat the Rapa Nuians.
 
So just read up on the subject before you complain.
 
 
 
An example of how Rapa Nuians sometimes are treated by Chileans.
 


Edited by Carcharodon - 29 Nov 2011 at 15:23
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 2011 at 19:14
I asked you a question, I did not "complain". Is there a concensus among the natives or not?
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 2011 at 21:06
A native with half cast child
The above is an early 20th century photograph of a "Rapa Nui" with her mestizo child. There the overarching question as to the very elemental issue with respect to Polynesian identity. The lady in the picture presented in this thread is certainly not the bearer of Polynesian characteristics and one has to immediately bring into question the purported statistics broached by dear Carch with respect to the numbering of true Polynesians as late as 1982.
 
For the photographic collection done early in the 20th century: http://libweb.hawaii.edu/digicoll/rapanui/people.html
 
Of course the polemics are more abundant than the actual ethnic group:
 
 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2011 at 00:35
Carcha is naive. The Rapa Nui are the ones asking the Chilean government to stop the immigration of New-Age ecolazzy tourists, that want to stay.

With respect of a Chilean invasion, there is no such. That's our country. Half the population has continental origins already. Besides, islanders can use the local and theirs country's flag without problem at all.








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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2011 at 00:36
Originally posted by Carcharodon Carcharodon wrote:

...Chile could leave a skeleton crew for health care, protection and economic aid and exchange but the increase of the chilean elements of the population on the expence of the Rapa Nuians ought to stop....


Who are you, lunatic fellow, to give orders to Chile? LOLLOL
Remember that you could follow the path of the King of Araucania, to get caged into a mad house Big smile
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2011 at 00:38
Originally posted by drgonzaga drgonzaga wrote:

 
The above is an early 20th century photograph of a "Rapa Nui" with her mestizo child. There the overarching question as to the very elemental issue with respect to Polynesian identity. The lady in the picture presented in this thread is certainly not the bearer of Polynesian characteristics and one has to immediately bring into question the purported statistics broached by dear Carch with respect to the numbering of true Polynesians as late as 1982. 


Today, most polynesians have some admixture with Chileans, but also with that large number of lunatic tourists that love Polynesia Wink
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2011 at 00:46
Originally posted by Styrbiorn Styrbiorn wrote:

No matter that the Chileans enslaved and killed most of them once upon a time, the important question here is what the Rapa Nui want, not what you think. Did you bother to consult them before deciding upon the course of action?


Sorry, but that's not true. Chileans didn't enslaved or killed the Rapa Nui. The slave riders from Peru did it. Chile took possetion of the island simply to prevent that Peru, or some evil superpower, like France or Britian, would take it for themselves.

Now, the worst Chilean crime at the island was to confine natives at a sector of it in order to grow sheeps in the rest of the island. True, that was abusive, but I wouldn't call it slavery or murder by any means. Even more, since the island is Chilean we have provide the place with resources continuosly.

What Carcha doesn't know, though, is that Easter Islanders are very nationalistics, are proud to be Chileans, and also are extremely Catholics! More Catholics than continental Chileans LOL. More Easter Islanders live in our contemporary society, and if Carcha believe the island is a happy copy of the deep Amazon, he is fooling himself.






Edited by pinguin - 30 Nov 2011 at 00:47
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2011 at 00:54
Originally posted by Carcharodon Carcharodon wrote:

Actually there are movements among the Rapa Nui for gaining more independance and to get back the land that the Chilans seized from them.
 
Even the UN is concerned about how the Chileans treat the Rapa Nuians.
 
So just read up on the subject before you complain.
 
 
 
An example of how Rapa Nuians sometimes are treated by Chileans.
 


That's biassed communist propaganda, comrade Carcha-lenin.

You can't confusse a very specific conflict, that went wild for one day, with a permanent situation.

For instance, if I follow yours logic, this is the reality of Sweden,









Edited by pinguin - 30 Nov 2011 at 00:57
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2011 at 07:22
Originally posted by Styrbiorn Styrbiorn wrote:

I asked you a question, I did not "complain". Is there a concensus among the natives or not?
 
As with everything else there can be varying opinions also among the Rapa Nui. But there is a growing movement that want to get more independance and who wants to get back the land the chileans have stolen from them. People do not protest without reason.
Also the decline of the Rapa Nui population are continuing. If the trend continues there will eventually be no, or at least very few true Rapa Nui left. Colonialism and and land theft can not be easily defended by questioning if there is a concensus by all the victims of colonisation about gaining more independance.
 
In all colonial situations you can always find some collaborators who runs the errands of the colonialists. And as expected the colonialsists and their promoters tend to listen very closely to eventual collaborators while they disregard the voices of the rest.
 
About the situation on Easter island
 
 
 
 
 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2011 at 07:40
Originally posted by pinguin pinguin wrote:

Sorry, but that's not true. Chileans didn't enslaved or killed the Rapa Nui. The slave riders from Peru did it. Chile took possetion of the island simply to prevent that Peru, or some evil superpower, like France or Britian, would take it for themselves. ?


Well, chileans stole their land and displaced them to the least favorable places on the island. And as for now chileans are simply outbreeding the Rapa Nui so fewer and fewer of them will be left.

Originally posted by pinguin pinguin wrote:

What Carcha doesn't know, though, is that Easter Islanders are very nationalistics, are proud to be Chileans, and also are extremely Catholics! More Catholics than continental Chileans LOL. More Easter Islanders live in our contemporary society, and if Carcha believe the island is a happy copy of the deep Amazon, he is fooling himself.
 
Still there is actually a growing movement of protesting islanders who want their island back.
 
Noone claims Easter island is like the Amazon, but still it is an example of a colonial situation with people that want their native land back and who dont want to be replaced by foreigners.
 
And some of their protests are met by violence from the colonialists.




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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2011 at 07:44
Originally posted by pinguin pinguin wrote:

That's biassed communist propaganda, comrade Carcha-lenin.
 
It seems that you considerer everyone who protests against landrobbery and colonialism a communist. That is surely biassed.

Originally posted by pinguin pinguin wrote:

You can't confusse a very specific conflict, that went wild for one day, with a permanent situation.
 
Incidents like this is a result of a permanent colonial situation.

Originally posted by pinguin pinguin wrote:

For instance, if I follow yours logic, this is the reality of Sweden,   
 
This thread is about Easter island. If you want to discuss Sweden it is better you open another thread.




Edited by Carcharodon - 30 Nov 2011 at 10:20
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2011 at 07:47
Originally posted by pinguin pinguin wrote:

With respect of a Chilean invasion, there is no such. That's our country. Half the population has continental origins already.
 
Well, everyone can invade other peoples territory, displace them and outbreed them and then call the land their own. I wonder how happy you would be if the Chinese, or perhaps a lot of Africans, or someone else did the same with Chile. 

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2011 at 07:49
Originally posted by drgonzaga drgonzaga wrote:

Of course the polemics are more abundant than the actual ethnic group:
 
Even if this particular ethnic group is small they still have the right to not be forced to live under colonial rule.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2011 at 08:38
Originally posted by pinguin pinguin wrote:


Sorry, but that's not true. Chileans didn't enslaved or killed the Rapa Nui. The slave riders from Peru did it. Chile took possetion of the island simply to prevent that Peru, or some evil superpower, like France or Britian, would take it for themselves.

So it's ok if Chile plays at imperialism, but not Peru, France or Britain? 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Dec 2011 at 00:48
Originally posted by Styrbiorn Styrbiorn wrote:

Originally posted by pinguin pinguin wrote:


Sorry, but that's not true. Chileans didn't enslaved or killed the Rapa Nui. The slave riders from Peru did it. Chile took possetion of the island simply to prevent that Peru, or some evil superpower, like France or Britian, would take it for themselves.

So it's ok if Chile plays at imperialism, but not Peru, France or Britain? 


Not in our region. Just imagine what the Brits have done to Argentineans. It is better for us that superpowers keep away from here. With respect to Peru, we have always defeated them since pre-Columbian times, so that's not a major concern at all.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Dec 2011 at 00:49
Originally posted by Carcharodon Carcharodon wrote:

 
As with everything else there can be varying opinions also among the Rapa Nui. But there is a growing movement that want to get more independance and who wants to get back the land the chileans have stolen from them. People do not protest without reason.
Also the decline of the Rapa Nui population are continuing. If the trend continues there will eventually be no, or at least very few true Rapa Nui left. Colonialism and and land theft can not be easily defended by questioning if there is a concensus by all the victims of colonisation about gaining more independance.
 


You speak pure baloney. Growing movement? Declining population? LOL

Please go to Africa with yours commie fantasy.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Dec 2011 at 00:52
Originally posted by Carcharodon Carcharodon wrote:

Well, chileans stole their land and displaced them to the least favorable places on the island. And as for now chileans are simply outbreeding the Rapa Nui so fewer and fewer of them will be left.


Nobody has stolen a land. Nobody is outbreeding them, but people mix.
You speak so much baloney.

Originally posted by Carcharodon Carcharodon wrote:


Still there is actually a growing movement of protesting islanders who want their island back.


That's not the point. The islanders want to have more power of decision in the country, and they deserve it. They aren't fighting for independence, which is absurd, giving most people in the island have links with the mainland.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Dec 2011 at 00:55
Originally posted by Carcharodon Carcharodon wrote:

It seems that you considerer everyone who protests against landrobbery and colonialism a communist. That is surely biassed.


Nope. I don't think so. But I do believe you are an agent of communism international. Or, at least, a communists that turn from red to green... like a traffic light LOL
 
Originally posted by Carcharodon Carcharodon wrote:


Incidents like this is a result of a permanent colonial situation.


No. It isn't.
 
Originally posted by Carcharodon Carcharodon wrote:


This thread is about Easter island. If you want to discuss Sweden it is better you open another thread.


Sure, let's not talk about Holly Sweden for now. Confused



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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Dec 2011 at 00:56
Originally posted by Carcharodon Carcharodon wrote:

 
Well, everyone can invade other peoples territory, displace them and outbreed them and then call the land their own. I wonder how happy you would be if the Chinese, or perhaps a lot of Africans, or someone else did the same with Chile.


I am happy with the Chinese comming, because they are ours relatives and work, and theirs women are cute. I can't say the same with respect to other ethnic groups.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Dec 2011 at 00:59
Originally posted by Carcharodon Carcharodon wrote:

 
Even if this particular ethnic group is small they still have the right to not be forced to live under colonial rule.


Sure, but that was it. And no communists or hippies are going to change that.

First, Sweden with let the Samis go and Danmark will let Greenland be free.


Edited by pinguin - 01 Dec 2011 at 00:59
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Dec 2011 at 07:49
Originally posted by pinguin pinguin wrote:

Nobody has stolen a land. Nobody is outbreeding them, but people mix.
You speak so much baloney. .

Actually Latinos from Chile have stolen a lot of the best land and the Rapa Nuians are slowly outbreed and suffocated by the invaders. It is strange that you accuse a lot of other countries for all sorts of things but you fail to recognize the colonial occupation that your own country are imposing on the Rapa Nui. That is hypocrisy.

Originally posted by pinguin pinguin wrote:

That's not the point. The islanders want to have more power of decision in the country, and they deserve it. They aren't fighting for independence, which is absurd, giving most people in the island have links with the mainland.

Actually, many islanders are getting tired of Chilean colonialism and want Chile to withdraw as much as possible and above all to return stolen land and property. They want to have more independence and right to make their own decisions about their own land. Rapa Nuians are getting tired of living in a colonial situation.

http://intercontinentalcry.org/chilean-police-violently-dislodging-the-rapanui-parliament/

http://www.eurasiareview.com/14032011-difficult-times-for-chiles-easter-island/

http://www.pantribalconfederacy.com/confederacy/News/pdf/rapanui.pdf

http://saverapanui.org/?paged=2

A vision of the future when Rapa Nui will be independent:

http://saverapanui.org/?page_id=181

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Dec 2011 at 11:28
Originally posted by pinguin pinguin wrote:


Not in our region. Just imagine what the Brits have done to Argentineans. It is better for us that superpowers keep away from here. With respect to Peru, we have always defeated them since pre-Columbian times, so that's not a major concern at all.
Your hypocrisy is phenomenal. Who defined "your region" to include Easter Island? And the Falklands to be included in some imaginary Argentinian "region"? You support the right of self determination of the Easter islanders (to belong to Chile) but not that of the Falklanders (to belong to the UK). It's no concern to you that Chile "always" defeats Peru, stealing land their land, but when Britain defeats someone it's simply evil imperialism. I'm simply amazed you don't realize your own double standards.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Dec 2011 at 14:41
What next, the "liberation" of the Galapagos from those nasty Ecuadorians. Interestingly, there is no European based agiprop over the political situation of Pitcairn Island or Tahiti for that matter. Gee, I wonder why? Perhaps the faux aborigines are not romantic enough despite there being far more numerous than any purported Rapa Nuians! After all the construct Rapa Nui is an European invention! Wonder what Carch has to say about a certain Capucin, Fr. Sebastian Englert.
 
Sebastian Englert, OFM. La Tierra de Hotu Matu'a. Santiago: Prensas de la Universidad de Chile, 1948.
 
What any and all contemporaries know of indigeneous language and culture properly termed Rapanuian (in acceptable Polynesian) derives from his pen, beginning with his Diccionario Rapanui-Espanol (1938).
 
Now let us enjoy that Polynesian staple, the sweet potato done Easter Island style...what you say that tuber is not of polynesian origin? Well it was cultivated on the island long before the advent of any European...
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Dec 2011 at 01:57
Originally posted by Carcharodon Carcharodon wrote:

Actually Latinos from Chile have stolen a lot of the best land and the Rapa Nuians are slowly outbreed and suffocated by the invaders. It is strange that you accuse a lot of other countries for all sorts of things but you fail to recognize the colonial occupation that your own country are imposing on the Rapa Nui. That is hypocrisy.

I don't know what do you mean by Latinos from Chile. Rapa Nuis and continentals are both Chileans. Even more, large numbers of Rapa Nuis move to the continent to work and study. Easter Island is like Greenland for Denmark. The same thing.

Originally posted by Carcharodon Carcharodon wrote:

Actually, many islanders are getting tired of Chilean colonialism and want Chile to withdraw as much as possible and above all to return stolen land and property. They want to have more independence and right to make their own decisions about their own land. Rapa Nuians are getting tired of living in a colonial situation.

You can't please everyone. But that doesn't mean that's a majoritary oppinions among the people living in Easter Island. In fact is not majoritary even among pure Polynesians.

So, stop yours dumb campains, financed by the International.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Dec 2011 at 01:58
By the way, this whole post is wrong, starting from the location of Easter Island, which IS NOT in South East Asia, but closer to South America than anything else.


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Dec 2011 at 02:04
Originally posted by Styrbiorn Styrbiorn wrote:

 
Your hypocrisy is phenomenal. Who defined "your region" to include Easter Island? And the Falklands to be included in some imaginary Argentinian "region"? You support the right of self determination of the Easter islanders (to belong to Chile) but not that of the Falklanders (to belong to the UK). It's no concern to you that Chile "always" defeats Peru, stealing land their land, but when Britain defeats someone it's simply evil imperialism. I'm simply amazed you don't realize your own double standards.


The Falklands didn't have natives, but it was part of Argentina up to the time the superpower you know, grab it. With respect to Peru, they should be thanksful we returned theirs country after we took it and controlled for a couple of years. Now, if you knew it, you will realize why Chinese and others forced workers fought at the Chilean side in those wars.

Now, the fact we have Easter Island is not strange, considering Denmark has Greenland, and countries like France, Britain, the U.S. and many others still control places that aren't even close to theirs countries but in the antipodes! Easter Island is just an island 3.000 km away from ours coast, and it wouldn't be nice for us some country from Europe controlled it.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Dec 2011 at 02:18
Quote The lady in the picture presented in this thread is certainly not the bearer of Polynesian characteristics
Just how much time have you spent in Polynesia anyway?

Because I've spent months on various islands and IME she does indeed look like a Polynesian woman-could be from the Cooks, or Tahiti, or Tonga or even Rotuma.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Dec 2011 at 02:21
Perhaps Charcha believes the polynesian type is the Melanesian, when in fact it is the Maori and Hawaian. Besides, most Polynesian peoples have some degree of admixture already with other peoples.
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